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Another supermarket trolley dash in the offing?

By Ian Henry

Reflections after the Anfield Defeat

(Ed’s note, there will be an editorial on Sunday’s game tomorrow (Tuesday). Until then, an offering from occasional contributor Ian Henry)

Six years ago, a shocking Arsenal performance (that 8-2 defeat at Man U) led to the astonishing acquisition spree that saw the BFG, Andre Santos, Yossi Benayoun, Park Chu-Yung and Mikel Arteta arrive in a blaze of something other than glory. The BFG has had his moments and Arteta went on to become one of the better captains Wenger has appointed, only to be allowed to join Man City’s coaching staff. I might be wrong but I think he still has a house in north London as I have seen him with his family around Hampstead. But I digress, apologies.

Six years after that shocker – actually that predictable mauling – at Old Trafford came another predictable shocker and mauling in the north-west, this time at Liverpool. It’s difficult to know where to start except to say that the one consistent thing about Wenger’s team selection this year is the utterly bemusing decision to start Ramsey and Xhaka as the central midfield pairing. These two have zero defensive discipline, with absolutely no understanding of how to protect the centre backs, let alone play a compact controlling game. I have lost count of how many goals we have conceded which flow directly from Xhaka giving the ball away, but along with death and taxes as certainties in life we can now add that Arsenal will concede at least once directly from Xhaka giving the ball away in each and every game; almost as certain is that Xhaka will get booked.

So, what happens now? Will Wenger recognise that his team selection, set-up and strategy has been wrong for all three games at the start of the season? Will he go out and back two holding midfielders to allow the team a semblance of a chance of controlling a game for the first twenty minutes for example? I doubt it.

Don’t let the win v Leicester fool you (the team led for all of 8 minutes of the 90, plus injury time), the defensive indiscipline and tactical naivete shown up so ruthlessly by Liverpool were clear on match day one. I can’t see Wenger changing at all (he hasn’t addressed the fundamental problems of the team for more than a decade so why should he now?) – he might buy one or two players, but even if he does, I have little faith that this will make any material difference. In any case, if you were Virgil van Dijk, Julian Draxler or Thomas Lemar why would you come to Arsenal, unless it was for the money? And if you were Shkodran Mustafi, you would surely take the first flight to Milan. And if you were Alexis Sanchez, if you can’t get the move you want to Manchester now, I’d take the rest of the year easy, enjoy the World Cup and wait for the mega pay cheque next year.

I don’t believe it matters who Arsenal sign or who they sell, either in the next few days or in January, or next summer. As long as Wenger remains in charge the same problems will remain unresolved. The question is how bad it will have to get before either the man himself gives up the ghost, the board finally press the panic button, or he really does lose the dressing room (personally I suspect he has but no one is prepared to break ranks, yet). All empires fail in the end, especially those run in a despotic manner and Arsenal is a despotic little empire, with a glorious past but no viable long term future under its current ruler.

From where I sit watching Arsenal these days (either on my sofa or in The Railway in West Hampstead rather than the west stand) it seems to me that it will likely have to get a lot worse before it will get any better. It’s just a matter of how quickly it gets worse. Bournemouth, Cologne, Chelsea, Doncaster, WBA and Bate Borisov in September: six games, four at home, two away. Arsenal need five wins at least (and a draw at Chelsea) to have any chance of a respectable season. What will the mad professor say if we can’t beat Bournemouth, Cologne, Doncaster and The Baggies at home? Because if Arsenal can’t win those four games, even Kroenke, Gazidis, Sir Chips and the rest of the board will surely have to admit they have backed the wrong horse, even if this comes several years too late.

One last thought, for those of you who want The Ox to stay: why would Chelsea or Liverpool meet Wenger’s asking price for him on the basis of his shop window performance at Anfield is beyond me.

28th August 2017 08:42:30

(9.5/10)

Comments and Reaction

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Up For Grabs Now  8:53am 28th Aug 2017

Didn’t see the game, so can’t comment on the game itself, but seriously, other than Wenger himself, was anybody truly surprised? This type of script is now no longer even farcical, I think the club is now in the territory of ‘How not to run a big football club on the pitch’ that will be studied for years to come (Not much studying required!). Arsenal will be (are) a by-word for self-inflicted stupidity of huge proportions, by retaining a manager so incredibly out of date, that it will be pondered over for years to come. In the meantime, everybody else just laughs and thanks their lucky stars, that on paper, one of their main competitors continues to commit hari-kari, by extending for a further two years this level of incompetency. Even now I am bewildered, confused and shocked that people like Graham Perry still exist (Previous article)! How can anybody with even just half a brain cell, not conclude that after all these years of in your face evidence, yet still somehow, they think that Wenger is the man to take this club forwards???? It’s a conundrum I have struggled with for so long now, why isn’t every supporter calling for Wenger’s head, how on earth can they still back him, whilst he continues dragging the name of this club further down (if that’s possible) the longer he remains?!?!?! Winning the FA Cup three times in the last four years is what’s keeping him in his job, certainly not his feeble attempts at winning the PL, or even feebler attempts in the CL. If he remains, my prediction is seventh in the PL, as I can see Everton overtaking us, along with both Manchester clubs, Liverpool, Chelsea and Spurs. This is where a club of Arsenal’s size and now former stature should be judged, not FA Cup wins, as Wenger has clearly demonstrated for ages now he will never win the PL again, as for the CL, don’t make me laugh, we won’t even be in that competition for the foreseeable future with Wenger at the helm. No doubt, as the thrust of this article has already stated by Ian, just like after the 8-2 mauling at Old Trafford a few years back, this week will once more resemble supermarket sweep time, to try to save his skin, by theoretically placating the fan base, as after all we can be bought, or so they think! For Christ sake, those who still attend home games, grow a pair and don’t be fooled again, regardless who they bring in or indeed let go before the next fixture. You could bring in Messi and Ronaldo and nothing would change, it’s the MANAGER that needs changing, the evidence of that is staring you in the face! Help end this what seems like a never-ending Groundhog Day farce, by calling a spade a spade, demand Wenger’s head at home games, irrespective if they happen to be winning a game, as it’s the bigger picture you need to think about, rather than 3 points against Bournemouth etc. - Post No. 109313


Petergooner  9:22am 28th Aug 2017

I saw the game, if you can call it that and my major concern now is I hope there will be a football game against Bournemouth and not a "boxing match or matches" in the stands when the "Wenger stay fans" and the "Wenger out fans" "talk to each other" before, during and after "the game". My major worry about this is that fans will be taken to the cells and also to hospital on stretchers because of "actions carried out". I hope but I am sure they do not, the Board, Wenger and even Stan K read this or thousands of other fans "worries" about what could happen next home game and what they have done to our club and where they are taking this wonderful club. To end, it is something when Thiery Henry states that "during the match he turned away and could not look" Please Thiery, Denis B, Patrick V come back and help us get our club back. - Post No. 109314


Rochey  9:23am 28th Aug 2017

Said it before. Two or three shambolic defeats and it's Wenger out. He has to go or we will go through this time and time again. It makes you wonder what they do in training, we could buy any top player in the world and it would not improve that team. The players are no longer being professional. The only way to get him out is a boycott, they (board) won't listen otherwise. It's the biggest joke in football now. Time and time again we have same problems. - Post No. 109315


MAF  9:23am 28th Aug 2017

i really dont blame Alexis. he's totally fed up with Wenger. of course he's not saying that in public. but hes not wrong is he ? hes sick of weak Players, lack of defence, lack of tactics, constantly giving away poor Goals. i really do not blame him at all. many of them are sick of the Manager ! - Post No. 109316


Exeter Ex  9:28am 28th Aug 2017

Performances like these are exactly why so many of us have wanted Wenger gone for so long. Anyone who can watch that and still back him a) doesn't understand what they're watching and b) put the man before the club. They just want what he wants, and all he wants is to remain in charge. But Wenger won't see anything wrong in his set up yesterday. Look at his comment "the performance was not at the requested level". The players simply didn't execute his 'vision' well enough, in his mind. It actually makes him dig deeper into his way of doing things. This is why it continues to happen and will continue for however long he remains. - Post No. 109317


Rochey  9:38am 28th Aug 2017

Comparison: Everton and Barkley Arsenal and OX...nuff said. No wonder the players show little respect, they can't be bothered. - Post No. 109318


Mark Mywurdz  9:51am 28th Aug 2017

Apart from anything else, what I can never understand is selection. Does Wenger actually watch the game? He would far rather shoehorn his favourite players into any old formation he can get away with. No balance whatsoever. Players obviously completely out of position. I can name at least 4 players who can be as horrendous as they like, week in week out, who are almost guaranteed a game. I mean, what is it? Is he frightened to upset people? The one glimpse of a bright spark is that Giroud and Lacazette seem to have an understanding. So why the **** not play them together? Go back to a 4-4-2 if necessary. Playing Ozil the way we do, simply doesn't work. Likewise Sanchez. Good player that they are, they add nothing to team play. Sell them. Forget them. Monreal at centre half? You couldn't make it up. Chamberlain, Xhaka and Ramsey together in midfield? Watching Liverpool stream forward with not one of those players even thinking about tracking back was too embarrassing for words. Look out for them when Liverpool scored their goals. Or rather not. The third goal was like you'd see at the average U11 match. Souness in the commentary was visibly seething, and he's a Liverpool man! Can you imagine the scene in the dressing room with the 1970s Liverpool team, after a performance like that? Your ears would burn. Meanwhile, Wenger insists this is "not the right time, to be emotional". What?! - Post No. 109319


TonyEvans  10:08am 28th Aug 2017

Never gave the game much thought, except to expect a 4 or 5 nil drubbing, and surprise surprise that was exactly what happened. From what I have read Wenger's team selection beggars belief. Lacazette on the bench, Monreal at CB, Kolasinac left out and two headless chickens masquerading as holding midfielders. I don't expect it would have made much of a difference whoever played but it might have given us half a chance. The only real surprise to me is that there are still fans willing to back Wenger after so many years of this type of abject display. - Post No. 109320


Mathews  10:14am 28th Aug 2017

Wondering what is Wenger out to prove ? Does he really think he can win PL or CL in his coaching career ever. Its going to be a long season, soon banners will fly over him. - Post No. 109321


Aylesbury Gooner  10:33am 28th Aug 2017

Jamie Redknapp had it right when he said Chelsea are ruthless when it comes to managers,win nothing and there out the door even when the manager wins the league or champions league there sacked.Us on the other hand just carry on and on same old ****,laughing stock thats what we are. - Post No. 109322


Badarse  11:23am 28th Aug 2017

So dispiriting. Seems as though we are about to enter the death throes of this Arsenal, though it could stutter and splutter for a while before croaking. We have painted ourselves into a corner, rather the sequence of events and decisions made have. Yet it is us. We are the passengers in the sidings, on the 'train Arsenal'. Can't get off, no platform. Don't want to anyway, it's my 'train Arsenal'. Hope of sorts remain. Change will occur. Bard is not the Dark Lord for nothing, he has his finger of certainty, still pushing that same old button, and the resulting evidence bears witness to the insight he possesses. Oh dear, quite sad really. Still, Arsenal badge on shirt, a walk in the sunshine, head held high. Ouch, didn't see that lamppost! The Mark of Nark your analysis was not completely on target but close enough, so can I get up from the couch now, and is it still OK to love my mum? Seriously, thank you for the words. Good old Arsenal. - Post No. 109323


markymark  11:45am 28th Aug 2017

Badarse - probably your most melancholic posting I've seen. It does feel a bit like the last night at a much loved venue before closing. I'm Thinking the Wigan Casino in 81'ish and then the grim sweep of Thatchers Britain. Pro or Anti I'm getting a general feeling in the air that things can't carry on like they are. A sharp retort against Bournemouth could keep him safe . Miserable defeat or draw and the circle will tighten. On a lighter note my Pseudo Psychiatrist skills are available anytime for just a smallish 'eye watering' hourly fee. - Post No. 109324


markymark  12:32pm 28th Aug 2017

I wonder if the Thierry Henry, Josh Kronke axis will swing into play? Obviously had bugger all effect last season but if it appears a desperate points grab is required to keep afloat whether Wengo will then be jettisoned. Personally a Shearer style management parachute feels me with little confidence. But I think we may get a dip post Wenger anyway before we start motoring again. I am fully behind Wengo's sacking just in case people think I've put on my flip flops. - Post No. 109325


RobG  12:33pm 28th Aug 2017

Only concerted protests by five or ten thousand - not five hundred can save the day. Can our bovine, tourist infested home support find the spirit ? All worms turn eventually. This might be the season ? - Post No. 109326


GSPM  13:10pm 28th Aug 2017

Nothing new to say , it's all been said before ( for yrs) bitterly disappointed for the fans and the players who have to put up with Wengers shortcoming . When to have a regime change we can all start hoping for better , for now we are doomed to going backwards . - Post No. 109327


mbg  13:29pm 28th Aug 2017

Danny (name)on MOTD last night asked where wenger starts on Monday morning (it'll probably be tomorrow the little pansie nice boys will have today off, pathetic)i'll tell you where the old weasel will start Danny boy fooking nowhere the senile old fool will just carry on as normal as if nothing happened and he did nothing wrong, nothing will be worked on, probably not even be discussed, just back to tippy tappy training round the cones and five a sides,oh and nice luvvie dovey photo as if everything's alright, pathetic. We want wenger out we want wenger out. - Post No. 109328


Bard  14:04pm 28th Aug 2017

A quite extraordinary state of affairs that cannot be rectified by a trolley dash. In the space of 3 games the club have gone from ( allegedly ) challenging for the title to also rans in mid table. Whether you are pro or anti Wenger I dont see how you come back when you have clearly lost the players. The attitude was appalling once again. I fail to see how Wenger can get through a season of such discord. The board need to step in and protect the man from himself. He deserves a dignified exit rather than being hounded for months. The club really are in a shambolic state. - Post No. 109329


mbg  14:24pm 28th Aug 2017

Good article Ian, spot on, yes TOF has certainly lot the dressing room and that has been the case now for a few seasons, an as you say the players are to afraid to speak up, my guess is they knew his contract was running out and like all of us were waiting for the out come hoping he'd piss off, and were as devastated as the rest of us when he didn't, but unfortunately the cowardly little nice boys still hadn't the balls to speak out and break ranks and do something about it directly and we all know why, they're to fooking comfortable on big money under no pressure, but thankfully as things are turning out (and no surprise and predicted by many) he's doing the job for us, and them, himself, and it can't come quick enough. We want wenger out. - Post No. 109330


KC38  14:40pm 28th Aug 2017

Bard you are correct he requires saving from himself, sadly there is not anyone with courage to oversee. I am very much in agreement that this club requires a new owner as well, but in saying that our performances are not the result of the owner, they are the responsibility of the manager. He has wasted 70 mill on Xhaka and Mustafi, his purchases with regard defensive players are shocking, his game plan shocking, his set up shocking, his ability to play into our opponents hands shocking, a top drawer manager would get a lot more out of this team, he must not be allowed to hid behind that awful human being Kronke. Lets deal with the manager and then hopefully the owner. Sadly only further poor results will do, my worry is we beat Bournemouth at home and its all smiles again until Chelsea which should be the judge of us but we all know the outcome, the judgements have been done over and over. Wenger must not be allowed to waste more money this week. - Post No. 109331


Moscowgooner  15:30pm 28th Aug 2017

I guess those who backed Wenger over the past 5 or 6 years, now still find it very hard to acknowledge that they were wrong throughout (although I see that Badarse has finally turned - sort of....). A 'sharp retort' against Bournemouth means nothing frankly; even a 4-1 win at Chelsea wouldn't change things for me. Wenger out now. The earlier rebuilding begins the better: an inspired managerial appointment might persuade Sanchez to stay - and others of quality to join. The real problem we're struggling with here is the Kroenke 'business model'. So we all know what chant we want to hear sweeping around the Emirates versus Bournemouth, regardless of the score, don't we? Kroenke goes, Wenger goes. - Post No. 109332


Time for change  16:04pm 28th Aug 2017

Xhaka trying to backheel the ball to Cech and every Arsenal outfield player in Liverpool's half on 57 minutes (not 91) sum it up for me. Wenger out now. - Post No. 109333


John F  16:23pm 28th Aug 2017

Deluded Arsenal fan on the radio today going on about players being played out of position,strikers on the bench,all the things most of us go on about except at the end of his call he refused to blame Wenger instead it was all the players fault.This call and the ex Liverpool manager Evans saying be careful what you wish for in regards losing Wenger created a very large bump on my forehead as a result of bashing my van steering wheel repeatably. - Post No. 109334


PradeepKachhala  16:43pm 28th Aug 2017

http://www.stltoday.com/sports/columns/jeff-gordon/gordo-kroenke-s-avalanche-doomed-to-more-suffering/article_4eeb490a-358a-5bf0-a5aa-7281e08ae570.html Read the above article and let me know if it sounds familiar - oh and blame David Dein for bringing these people to our club - Post No. 109335


BigDaveTheGooner  16:50pm 28th Aug 2017

The Ox is off to the Chavs apparently,well you can certainly say his mind wasn't on yesterday's game,he played as though he couldn't give a s hit,that just about sums it all up!!!!!! How much more of this persistent nonsense do we have to put up with???? Any one in their right mind knows it's not right,even those that haven't been in football for 5 minutes knows this.Come on Wenger and do the right thing and walk away. - Post No. 109336


KC38  18:12pm 28th Aug 2017

So, Thursday the Ox tells Wenger he wants out, Monday a fee is agreed with CFC. In between we play him at right back, a right back at left back and leave a centre back on the bench and play a young raw CB, while leaving a new left sided defensive player on the bench! It's beyond explanation, it does appear the manager has lost all touch with reality and is totally deluded. Wenger is finished it's just how bad it gets before he goes. - Post No. 109337


mbg  18:20pm 28th Aug 2017

Faith starting to be restored in the luvvie pundits Keown last night, Shearer today, Arsenal fans will think nothing has changed but it's actually got worse (not us all AL)it was as if TOF found 11 random players and put them all together and told them to get on with it (love that and he's not far wrong lol) and chief luvvie himself Henry ? asking (is he turning ? or has he turned ? either way he knows f*****g to well what/who the problem is) Why would you want to stay at Arsenal ? Ouch, they're not going to want to be part of this team, Ouch, that's why players aren't renewing their contracts they can see something is wrong at Arsenal from top to bottom and it has been like that for a long time, Ouch, (yes for 10 years now and we all know exactly who/what)admitted he wanted to leave yesterday and turned his chair and back on the match, Ouch, i'd say TOF and his wengerites (if there's any left)were making up a fresh list of enemies over their croissants this morning. We want wenger out we want wenger out. - Post No. 109338


mbg  18:35pm 28th Aug 2017

Petergooner, hoping there'll be a game against Bournemouth (in other words an easy win and all will be back to normal)worried about fans fighting and going to cells, and not once saying why, and who because off, and who is the problem and has to go, says all we need to know, no wonder he's still in the job, pathetic. wenger out now. - Post No. 109339


CORNISH GOONER  19:30pm 28th Aug 2017

Tweet from "The Donald": "Bad news for friend Stan, a great American. Soccer club trashed. players bunch of losers. coach old french guy, crazy dude. sad." - Post No. 109340


mbg  19:55pm 28th Aug 2017

So Chelsea's bid for the Ox has been accepted ? I personally don't give a fook whether he stays or goes (as he's never going to improve under TOF) but well done Ox for showing ambition and getting out and embarrassing the old weasel some more, I want to build zee teem around aleex, what does that tell you wenger ? lets see what he does at the chavs now under a proper manager who knows what he's doing. wenger out tonight. - Post No. 109341


markymark  20:17pm 28th Aug 2017

John F - I think I heard the fan as well. Fan:) Hello, hello this is TOOAW... Radio presenter; "I'm sorry I didn't quite catch that name?" Fan:) "I said TOOAW!" Presenter: "Sorry did you say tOooooAw?" Fan:) No it's TOOAW you shout it don't yer!" Presenter: "Ok caller, I still didn't get that name but please continue" Fan:) " Well it's Mr Wenger init, I mean Mr Wenger he does brilliant dun'e' and if e" want to put a left back in right back and a right back in centre back and centre midfielder in wingback he can do that can't e' , coz e's brilliant like. Presenter:) Well that's very interesting?!? , so Mr Wenger has no blame at all? Fan:) Yes , but no, but yes , but , no but ...but ... NO HE FACKIN DOESN'T YER FACKIN........ Radio Hosts.. We are very sorry to all our listeners , I'm afraid that's quite enough and onto the next caller please! - Post No. 109342


Paulward  20:23pm 28th Aug 2017

Mustafi the next to depart. Never has the term rats leaving a sinking ship been more apt. Shame the biggest rodent of them all doesn't join them. WengerOut. - Post No. 109343


Paulo75  21:23pm 28th Aug 2017

Gary Neville, a pundit whose views I largely respect (Stamford Bridge apart), lets rip into Arsenal's woeful performance yesterday yet still thinks Wenger is blameless - seriously WTF? Any Manager with a tactical brain - let alone one who has first hand experience on numerous occasions, knows you don't go to Anfield with a midfield like that possessing zero grit and determination, not to mention desire to compete. - Post No. 109345


TOOAW  21:24pm 28th Aug 2017

Yaaaaawwwwnnn. Right now where were we???. Nice bit of profit on the limp one called Alex eh Arsene. Just the Chile lad to go and we're into a good bit of profit Stan. If that team from Meeelan call, our centre half ???he's gone too. Business is where we are eh mark of nark. I'm going into your section 2 if ok. Gawd diddly damn suckers. This Arsanal club is easy dollars and they still pay for the soccer. Scotland the brave.... play that anthem. God bless......... Stanley. xxxxxxx - Post No. 109346


markymark  22:45pm 28th Aug 2017

Stockholm syndrome (sometimes erroneously referred to as Helsinki syndrome)[1][2] is a condition that causes hostages to develop a psychological alliance with their captors as a survival strategy during captivity.[3] These feelings, resulting from a bond formed between captor and captives during intimate time spent together, are generally considered irrational in light of the danger or risk endured by the victims. ---- >AKB's anyone? - Post No. 109347


Roy  22:48pm 28th Aug 2017

I'm not going to use various platitudes or dissect AW's lack of tactical acumen, as it's already been done. ( God knows what comments will be on here tomorrow after the editorial ). All I wish to say at this point is that I first went to Highbury in 1971 when Eddie Kelly scored that vital winner against Stoke with the double being secured a few days later. NEVER since then have I felt as disappointed and apathetic as I do now. Wenger now needs saving from himself, and the only question now is how much worse it can get before the inevitable conclusion when in fact, he should be sacked right now.That one of the worlds greatest clubs has allowed this to happen is a travesty in itself. We used to be a byword for class. Now we are a laughing stock. Desperate stuff, indeed. - Post No. 109349


mbg  0:44am 29th Aug 2017

Don't worry Alexis you'll not have to cover your face for much longer your nightmare will soon be over, you'll soon be out of it, away to f**k from about him (with your reputation still in tact not having allowed him to ruin you)and moved on to much better things, and good luck, unfortunately it's not as easy for us as we can't do that (and the old weasel would just love that anyway) we're stuck with the old past it fraud but hopefully not for much longer as he's digging his own grave as every day, week, embarrassment goes by. wenger out now. - Post No. 109352


markymark  8:36am 29th Aug 2017

Good to see the greediest mediocrity in football getting the kicking he deserves. Same old training , nothing changes (coming out of the dressing room) , they should bin him from Ian Wright and the papers laying the blame squarely at his door. - Post No. 109357


GSPM  8:57am 29th Aug 2017

Any player bought by close of window is money wasted. The problem is Wenger, not the players. We all know the drill, panic buy to get himself out of a hole, he is finished, only solution for Arsenal to progress is for Wenger to leave, everything else is just papering over the cracks, which are now as wide as the Grand Canyon.... - Post No. 109358


Hi Berry  9:44am 29th Aug 2017

Looks like the end game is fast approaching...lots of press reports about player apathy as a result of the 'catalyst for change' being no more than three words trotted out to try and keep a lid on a situation that most on here have been watching build steadily over the past few seasons. The worm is at last turning in the areas it needs to with players questioning the Almighty One. Cast your minds back to RVP shaking his head in disbelief when Wenger took off a player who was having a stormer of a game a few seasons back. I seem to recall that player was Oxlade-Chamberlain which presents a delightful irony to proceedings! It seems incredible that it has taken this long for the penny to finally drop for so many people. In renewing his contract no doubt Wenger had half an eye on surpassing Fergies record of PL matches (still a tantalising 16 or 17 short, I believe) and 26 years as a manager which ultimately proves that absolute power corrupts absolutely. - Post No. 109361


Bard  9:59am 29th Aug 2017

I am sometimes accused by my dear wife of not paying attention so forgive my muddle over the Ox saga. I read we are about to sell him to the Chavs or Liverpool. Am I right in remembering that a week or two ago the great one was waxing lyrically, if a little oddly, that we werent selling anyone and were going to let their contracts run down because this is the way football is going in the future ? If Im confused imagine how the players feel. Fyi guys give Graham Perry articles the swerve, he hasnt a clue about football. - Post No. 109362


The Man From UNCLE  10:00am 29th Aug 2017

Hopefully the end game is fast approaching. I would gladly take a season of mid table mediocrity (as opposed to several seasons of top 4 mediocrity ho ho) if it means change. But we must beware the French plas ca change - the more things change the more they stay the same. - Post No. 109363


Badarse  10:37am 29th Aug 2017

Morning peeps. MoscowGooner, just to explain. I have not turned. My dodgy knee won't allow for that, no swivelling and swerving in public, thank you very much. I have, and always will support the manager of my football club up to a point, as I have managers in industry throughout my life, as I do my country. That does not mean that I agree in total or in part with specific actions. I love my country but distanced myself over 20 years ago from International football as I disliked the hype and covert nationalism it personified. A number of times I have called International Football a dinosaur on this site; designed to bring nations together it separates and fuels at the extreme end the little Englanders, and that is leaving aside the corruptions it brings as in WCs etc., All this from one of the surviving 92k who actually stood in the warm July sun that day in 1966 inside Wembley stadium, watching the sun glint off the Jules Remit Trophy-(another crazy old French guy), I actually saw England win the World Cup live, (of course they did play in red and white that day). Change is inevitable. I am also against witch-hunts and lynch parties so would choose my own course and my own compatriots. It has never passed me by that a group can call for change ferociously within a pocket of existence whilst keeping schtum as they support that very status quo on a wider scale-yes I am talking politics. I have a friend of a friend who is gay, and through the connection I met many in the group. It astonished me that all were in constant flux about the prejudices which they encountered, yet every one supported a right wing government, voted them in, propped them up, and could not connect the dots on the page. Scary. Hope it explains things a little. - Post No. 109365


Its up for grabs 89  10:53am 29th Aug 2017

We (including myself) fans should be really ashamed of ourselves for letting our club down. This club is ours, how can we stand by and let this happen. All it takes is 30% of the home crown to chant 'Wenger out' during home matches regardless of score for not more than 3 home games and it's over. He can't stay after that. We deserve what we get as we had the perfect opportunity last year and I did rally around me to my disbelieve that no one had the courage and so I sat back down again in fear. The fans of Man U, Liverpool, Chelsea, Man city, in fact 90% of clubs around the world would not sit and watch and mumble with their faces down, he is a dictator but we are not in Lybia, and even there there was change in the end. It's in our hands still. But I know I'm waiting my breath. - Post No. 109366


BigDaveTheGooner  10:56am 29th Aug 2017

Wow Badarse,you astonish me.You actually know someone who knows someone that is gay,that is an amazing admission,just goes to show how far you are behind the times. I am actually more amazed you don't know any one who is gay,you need to get out more mate!!!!! - Post No. 109368


CORNISH GOONER  10:59am 29th Aug 2017

Monsieur Badarse - credit where credit is due, the first post I have managed to finish, of manageable length, in plain english & which I could fully understand. You rightly refer to a bigger picture. You have the makings of a "Good Dude" if you go on to accept that The Crazy French Guy is past it. - Post No. 109369


Badarse  11:05am 29th Aug 2017

Hello BigDave, I employ artistic license on occasions and my post was couched in a superficial manner to cut to the specific point, shame you focussed on the minutiae but it does happen. Have been on two Pride festivals, dislike the term marches), and one was international. I personally do not hang with the crowd, I generally find a group of like-minded individuals take on a herd mentality. I worked in an industry where gays were very high profile so encountered many. I know enough, but thank you for the wishes to get me out more in that wonderful August sunshine, sometimes I have work to do indoors though. Bit over simplified its up for grabs 89, and remember Libya certainly did change and is now in disarray. - Post No. 109370


Its up for grabs 89  11:23am 29th Aug 2017

Badarse- didn't you just have a go to BigDave about focusing on the "minutiae" ? Then you did the same about Lybia. Tell me please how I'm simplifying? Don't we all want out club to succeed, and how can that happen without change, and how will change come? Not by Wenger as that is now beyond doubt. Wenger is doing what benefits him only, he is in a very unique and fortunate position. It's up to us trust me. Let's stop fighting between ourselves that is how powers remain powers by deviding and concouring. I wrote this fast so please don't come back with a grammar lesson and focus on the point. - Post No. 109372


Badarse  11:32am 29th Aug 2017

Morning Cornish, I take the point in the spirit intended but I think you do me a slight disservice as I have posted 'sensible' entries on numerous occasions. Sometimes if they find the bit between their teeth my posts can be twisted and turned by those who have an agenda. I can do joined up writing and can communicate coherently, however it is sometimes not so easy using this mode. You write a sentence aware that you don't want to go down a cul de sac, and it can encourage short cuts, but a recipient picks up on the unimportant as BigDave did. I find it difficult to converse with an old person calling someone they criticise as 'old'. mbg is unaware of the meaning of the word relative for instance-though he does have an aged aunt in Limerick, he is old to children, but cannot make that bridge, and there are other aspects which make my eyebrows rise and me go cross-eyed. The pressure has mounted and I see it as a, 'Build it and they will come, Ray!' - Post No. 109373


BigDaveTheGooner  11:32am 29th Aug 2017

Perhaps then Badarse if it was a Wenger out festival rather than a Wenger out march you would participate!!!!! - Post No. 109374


Exeter Ex  11:47am 29th Aug 2017

So to summarise the Badarse philosophy: Change is inevitable, but collectively pushing for change is bad, as that's a herd mentality. And if people don't push for change on a broader societal level, to push for change on an individual issue is somehow discredited. On this site, where others may see a lot of independent reasoned critical analysis, Badarse sees a brainwashed lynch mob, a witch hunt. So we can deduce that Badarse believes we should simply wait for Wenger to become too old to do the job, or incapacitated in some other way, or decide for himself he's had enough, or perhaps the owner will suddenly become ambitious and sack him. We should simply wait for that change to occur, and support Wenger for however many more years it takes for one of those events to evolve into being. - Post No. 109375


Badarse  12:06pm 29th Aug 2017

its up for grabs 89, you mentioned Big Dave. I wasn't having a go at the lad, he wears his heart on his sleeve, nothing wrong in that. I was just trying to explain that we are different and I would not support the 'Wenger Out' gang as an entity. Funny thing is I wasn't having a dig at you regarding Libya, just mentioning it. You did, I did. By the way I have a Gooner shirt with 'It's up for grabs now...' and I wore it as a PJ top the last time I was in hospital-it defies any negative comment from reasonable people. That night one of the single greatest evenings of my life-yours too? I am not up for insurrection when it comes to my football club-this answers BigDave's question too. Things will change with or without me. I have mentioned that I am a serial protestor, I am also a cereal protestor too as there is too much sugar coated on them. As the former, protesting for over half a century I have probably achieved zilch. I've voted in every election, general and local, boogied rather than marched on innumerable CND demos, and I survey my country as is. Still the pooch of the USA, still with a totally useless and incompetent government, more slavery, child abuse, ignorance, and the quality of life descending by the day. Whatever happened to the 60s view, 'For my children's children.'? As a flower child of the 60s I wanted to change the world for the better-as I saw better-instead the tank of our society just ran over my toe. Never a reason to not stand up, but cut slack to those who see a different perspective. Would never be so picky about grammar unless the gloves were off, then we can take on street-fighters personas. So, sorry for the misunderstanding. - Post No. 109378


BigDaveTheGooner  13:58pm 29th Aug 2017

Badarse,as much I should respect your point of view, I and probably hundreds, even thousands of others are clearly unable to. Your argument in keeping Wenger in charge of team affairs is futile and defies any common sense. Where on earth is the improvement going to come from? He is tactically naive to the point of embarrassment,he cannot coach,he buys players that he cannot motivate and subsequently sells them off ,he plays players in positions totally alien to them( and not even on the right side of the pitch). He's transfer policy is atrocious,Sanchez apart name another player he has actually bought that has improved under his management in the last 10 years and Sanchez is only better because he has the heart and desire to do well. Are you really that naive to think that Wenger is still any good? Let me quote Klopp after Sunday's mauling " to play against Arsenal you must not give them space and deprive them of the ball" there you have it in a nutshell,every premier league manager knows this hence the failure to compete. Wenger is a busted flush who had his time 12 years ago and there's no way forward with him!!!! - Post No. 109389


Exeter Ex  16:10pm 29th Aug 2017

So Badarse, you’ve become disillusioned as over that half-century you haven’t seen the kind of progress in society that you and many others would’ve liked to have seen. That is totally understandable. However, this site is for people to air their views. That is its purpose. What you do instead of giving a coherent counterview is tell others that airing those views is futile, or wrong, or attempt to police the site in other ways, or clog it up with cul-de-sacs. You use words like ‘brainwashed’, ‘rabble’, ‘lynch mob’, ‘witch hunt’ ‘insurrection’. This is ridiculously over-the-top language for people who would simply like to see a change of manager at a football club and/or a change of direction at that football club. You ask to be cut some slack but you don't cut it yourself. This carry on is intensely irritating and is the reason ire is directed towards you. If only this would sink in. - Post No. 109395


Yes its Ron  11:01am 30th Aug 2017

Loved that trolley dash in 2011! The Arteta signing seemed a good one. Sadly, it was that time after the 8-2 and the Clubs desperate reaction to that result that many people including myself started to find Arsenal amusing and quaint. Sadly, since then the Club has just become more cynical from a fans perspective i feel. - Post No. 109419


Issue #266 - Out Now!

Gooner Editorial

21st September 2017

Arsenal Squeeze Past Doncaster

Online Ed – League Cup progress in front of half-full Emirates