As we're unlikely to see terraces again at football, this is the virtual equivalent where you can chat to your hearts content about all football matters and, obviously, Arsenal in particular. This forum encourages all Gooners to visit and contribute so please keep it respectful, clean and topical.
GoonerMuzz wrote:he's a player who played successfully for 19 years in EPL under arguably (i can't believe i'm going to admit this) the best Manager in the EPL so far
Really? It's arguable that Ferguson's the best PL manager of all-time?
armchair wrote:August 2005. 10 years ago...........
The missus had thrown me a surprise 40th birthday party in our house. Friends and family were there and drinking and hilarity ensued. Fun was had by all.
We had gone unbeaten 2003-2004 and managed to fluke the FA Cup 2005 on pens just a few months before my surprise party.
Remember having a convo with my brother-in-laws girlfriend (family are spuds but shes a bit of an Arsenal admirer) about Arsenal and Wenger. I remember it well. She couldnt believe it when I dared to suggest that Wenger had taken us as far as he could and needed to go. I felt that with a few good signings we could be dominant in the Prem and win CL trophys going forward but I couldnt see Wenger making the necessary changes to propel us from good to great.
Fast forward 10 years and couple weeks ago, guess what?............
The missus threw me a surprise 50th birthdy party in our house. Friends and family gathered and drinking and hilarity ensued. Fun was had by all.
The brother-in-law and his girlfriend now have an 8 year old little boy but have split up and have new partners. But hey, guss what.........?
Wenger is still lingering at Arsenal like a bad smell. We've just won the FA Cup, just like 10 years ago, and would you Adam-n-Eve it? We still need a few good signings to take us to the next level. To take us from top four also rans to actual, legitimate contenders.
Heres to the next 10 years under Wenger.
I'm guessing the 60th birthday party won't be so much of a surprise.
armchair wrote:August 2005. 10 years ago...........
The missus had thrown me a surprise 40th birthday party in our house. Friends and family were there and drinking and hilarity ensued. Fun was had by all.
We had gone unbeaten 2003-2004 and managed to fluke the FA Cup 2005 on pens just a few months before my surprise party.
Remember having a convo with my brother-in-laws girlfriend (family are spuds but shes a bit of an Arsenal admirer) about Arsenal and Wenger. I remember it well. She couldnt believe it when I dared to suggest that Wenger had taken us as far as he could and needed to go. I felt that with a few good signings we could be dominant in the Prem and win CL trophys going forward but I couldnt see Wenger making the necessary changes to propel us from good to great.
Bloody hell, you wanted him gone 18 months after the invincibles?
Talk about ahead of the curve I considered Arsene to be an incredible manager at that time and no way in the world did I want him gone.
You've been proved right but 2005 was very early to come to that conclusion.
For me it was the 2007-08 season when we failed to recruit in January and ran out of steam in the title race. We then lost Gilberto, Diarra and Flamini within 6 months of each other yet didn't sign a central midfielder in the summer meaning Cesc went from being the youngest of our midfielders to being the leader overnight - that was the start of the Song and Denilson era; when project youth went from being interesting/exciting to being a sign of Wenger's insanity
Is there a virtual trophy for the poster who wanted Wenger gone the earliest?
Wanted him gone when he took over from superstar Rioch who signed DB10 and was replaced by some geezer with frogeye sprite size glasses from some crappy Jap club
I had my doubts about him for many months before but the tipping point was the 8-2 drubbing.
We had gone through all the pre season, he seemed happy enough, no doubt telling the press he was happy with the squad.
Then the morning after on deadline day he panic buys 4 players and Traore is gone! from first team to gone in 24 hours.
It posed the question "how well did he know the team, and its qualities?" and it was the day I knew Wenger was a busted flush.
armchair wrote:August 2005. 10 years ago...........
The missus had thrown me a surprise 40th birthday party in our house. Friends and family were there and drinking and hilarity ensued. Fun was had by all.
We had gone unbeaten 2003-2004 and managed to fluke the FA Cup 2005 on pens just a few months before my surprise party.
Remember having a convo with my brother-in-laws girlfriend (family are spuds but shes a bit of an Arsenal admirer) about Arsenal and Wenger. I remember it well. She couldnt believe it when I dared to suggest that Wenger had taken us as far as he could and needed to go. I felt that with a few good signings we could be dominant in the Prem and win CL trophys going forward but I couldnt see Wenger making the necessary changes to propel us from good to great.
Bloody hell, you wanted him gone 18 months after the invincibles?
Talk about ahead of the curve I considered Arsene to be an incredible manager at that time and no way in the world did I want him gone.
You've been proved right but 2005 was very early to come to that conclusion.
For me it was the 2007-08 season when we failed to recruit in January and ran out of steam in the title race. We then lost Gilberto, Diarra and Flamini within 6 months of each other yet didn't sign a central midfielder in the summer meaning Cesc went from being the youngest of our midfielders to being the leader overnight - that was the start of the Song and Denilson era; when project youth went from being interesting/exciting to being a sign of Wenger's insanity
Kind of the same for me only it wasn't failing to recruit in January that year (we were flying at that point tbf) but that summer. I remember how desperate we were for both a DM & CB and then the morning after the 08 summer transfer window closes, I go on Arsenal.com and what do I see? Fucking Silvestre's ugly face plastered across it, the terrible United defender that I used to take the piss out of to my Cockney red mates because of how shit he was and that was about 5 years before we signed him!!! That's you're solution to our defensive problems you *word censored*?
I realized Wenger would never have us competing at the highest level again, but with the Arshavin signing & reaching the CL semi's I got strong along for about a season & half hoping he'd turned over a new leaf & turn it around. It was just another false dawn, a fact that was really driven home when our first team got twatted by Birmingham in the 2011 final. Saw Cesc's "fuck these losers I'm out of here" face that day & when he left later that year I couldn't even hold it against him because like him I knew we wouldn't win any major honors.
GoonerMuzz wrote:he's a player who played successfully for 19 years in EPL under arguably (i can't believe i'm going to admit this) the best Manager in the EPL so far
Really? It's arguable that Ferguson's the best PL manager of all-time?
The guy who won it 13 times?
Hate the bastard but Sir Alex is the best manager in the history of football.
I think that's even less contentious than Messi being the best player in the history of football (which he is).
GoonerMuzz wrote:he's a player who played successfully for 19 years in EPL under arguably (i can't believe i'm going to admit this) the best Manager in the EPL so far
Really? It's arguable that Ferguson's the best PL manager of all-time?
The guy who won it 13 times?
Hate the bastard but Sir Alex is the best manager in the history of football.
I think that's even less contentious than Messi being the best player in the history of football (which he is).
GoonerMuzz wrote:he's a player who played successfully for 19 years in EPL under arguably (i can't believe i'm going to admit this) the best Manager in the EPL so far
Really? It's arguable that Ferguson's the best PL manager of all-time?
The guy who won it 13 times?
Hate the bastard but Sir Alex is the best manager in the history of football.
I think that's even less contentious than Messi being the best player in the history of football (which he is).
Best Manager in the prem no doubt. Best manager of all time? I think you could pull up quite a few contenders for that crown.
Theoperator wrote:Is there a virtual trophy for the poster who wanted Wenger gone the earliest?
Wanted him gone when he took over from superstar Rioch who signed DB10 and was replaced by some geezer with frogeye sprite size glasses from some crappy Jap club
I wanted Wenger gone after he made the claim that arsenal could go unbeaten in the league over a season. To raise expectations so high and to fullfill them, everything after was gonna be a let down. Bastard.
Surely there are far more people who went early on the Wenger out?
What about the start of his first full season 97/98:
Out of the UEFA Cup (when it meant something) to PAOK Salonika at home - in a misinterpretation of tactics and misunderstanding of how to defend a European home tie with 'Away Goals' at stake - something that became oh too familiar
Also the home defeats to Liverpool and Blackburn before Xmas that season...
In fact I'm almost certain a few people were out in the road shouting up to the Highbury dressing rooms after that one...
Something a lot of people forget when discussing Wenger and his reign at the club... After the Blackburn game Adams and Keown suggested a new method to him and he made one of Vieira or Petit sit back at any one time and protect the back four - we then went on an amazing run and won the double. If Adams and Keown hadn't have intervened he'd be a footnote in Arsenal history.
GoonerMuzz wrote:he's a player who played successfully for 19 years in EPL under arguably (i can't believe i'm going to admit this) the best Manager in the EPL so far
Really? It's arguable that Ferguson's the best PL manager of all-time?
The guy who won it 13 times?
Hate the bastard but Sir Alex is the best manager in the history of football.
I think that's even less contentious than Messi being the best player in the history of football (which he is).
Best Manager in the prem no doubt. Best manager of all time? I think you could pull up quite a few contenders for that crown.
Agreed. For example, comparing Ferguson's achievements at United and Clough's achievements at Derby and Forest is difficult because they were era-specific. Back in the late 70s/80s, there just wasn't the money in football to build a behemoth like Ferguson did at United and Forest were never had the same sort of foundation as United. Equally, in the modern(ish) era it just wouldn't be possible to take sides from second-tier also rans to top-flight champions and top dogs in Europe.
GoonerMuzz wrote:he's a player who played successfully for 19 years in EPL under arguably (i can't believe i'm going to admit this) the best Manager in the EPL so far
Really? It's arguable that Ferguson's the best PL manager of all-time?
The guy who won it 13 times?
Hate the bastard but Sir Alex is the best manager in the history of football.
I think that's even less contentious than Messi being the best player in the history of football (which he is).
Just realised I disagree with both of these statements!
With regards to messi again we are being a bit too era specific. He is no doubt the best player in the world at the moment, but to genuinely be declared the best player of all time he has to do it in the world cup. Pele did it in 1970, Maradona did it in 1986 (with a mediocre team around him) but Messi has had two goes and hasn't shone at all. So in my opinion it's not even up for discussion until he does.