CROWDFUNDING - WENGER GONE, NOW REMOVE KROENKE

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xisstential
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Re: CROWDFUNDING - REMOVE WENGER & KROENKE

Post by xisstential »

The enormity of the task is inside the ground, whether it be Wenger or Kroenke.. What I would be willing to do is get in with about 20 of us on one of those crappy Thursday nights, all with banners and kick up a helluva row for the entire match. We would somehow have to be together or at least in close proximity. 20 guys scattered around the stadium will be meaningless. I thought a Europa night because it might be easier to all get seats close to each other and from there we can ignite the crowd...Hopefully??? Outside the ground is hopeless, it doesn't get on TV...... beamed across the world is what I mean.

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Rugby Gooner
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Re: CROWDFUNDING - REMOVE WENGER & KROENKE

Post by Rugby Gooner »

xisstential wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 5:08 pm
The enormity of the task is inside the ground, whether it be Wenger or Kroenke.. What I would be willing to do is get in with about 20 of us on one of those crappy Thursday nights, all with banners and kick up a helluva row for the entire match. We would somehow have to be together or at least in close proximity. 20 guys scattered around the stadium will be meaningless. I thought a Europa night because it might be easier to all get seats close to each other and from there we can ignite the crowd...Hopefully??? Outside the ground is hopeless, it doesn't get on TV...... beamed across the world is what I mean.
Any protest inside the bowl wouldn't last more than a minute.
"They" own the property,so would have it shut down post haste.
There would also be the AKB/Hipster?Tourists to contend with,and the stewards would side with them

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NickF
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Re: CROWDFUNDING - REMOVE WENGER & KROENKE

Post by NickF »

Rugby Gooner wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 6:11 pm
xisstential wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 5:08 pm
The enormity of the task is inside the ground, whether it be Wenger or Kroenke.. What I would be willing to do is get in with about 20 of us on one of those crappy Thursday nights, all with banners and kick up a helluva row for the entire match. We would somehow have to be together or at least in close proximity. 20 guys scattered around the stadium will be meaningless. I thought a Europa night because it might be easier to all get seats close to each other and from there we can ignite the crowd...Hopefully??? Outside the ground is hopeless, it doesn't get on TV...... beamed across the world is what I mean.
Any protest inside the bowl wouldn't last more than a minute.
"They" own the property,so would have it shut down post haste.
There would also be the AKB/Hipster?Tourists to contend with,and the stewards would side with them
Two seasons ago i would have agreed but last season there was very little opposition inside to protest. In fact i actually got more people saying "well done".

Good posts by Clash and Retro. All i would add is that i have no problem going after Kroenke by I'll be damned if I'm going to let Wenger off the hook.

Have to say i do like the idea of causing some mayhem at a Europa cup night.

Retro Gunner
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Re: CROWDFUNDING - REMOVE WENGER & KROENKE

Post by Retro Gunner »

NickF wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 6:17 pm
Rugby Gooner wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 6:11 pm
xisstential wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 5:08 pm
The enormity of the task is inside the ground, whether it be Wenger or Kroenke.. What I would be willing to do is get in with about 20 of us on one of those crappy Thursday nights, all with banners and kick up a helluva row for the entire match. We would somehow have to be together or at least in close proximity. 20 guys scattered around the stadium will be meaningless. I thought a Europa night because it might be easier to all get seats close to each other and from there we can ignite the crowd...Hopefully??? Outside the ground is hopeless, it doesn't get on TV...... beamed across the world is what I mean.
Any protest inside the bowl wouldn't last more than a minute.
"They" own the property,so would have it shut down post haste.
There would also be the AKB/Hipster?Tourists to contend with,and the stewards would side with them
Two seasons ago i would have agreed but last season there was very little opposition inside to protest. In fact i actually got more people saying "well done".

Good posts by Clash and Retro. All i would add is that i have no problem going after Kroenke by I'll be damned if I'm going to let Wenger off the hook.

Have to say i do like the idea of causing some mayhem at a Europa cup night.

I'd be up for this.

Maybe a few of the Irish lads could get over for it. I think they'd have some Celtic fire in their bellies, unlike many of our docile English supporters, who are worried about offending Uncle Arsene. I do, however, appreciate the possibly prohibitive cost involved in getting here.

Would it be impossible to get forty or fifty seats in close proximity for a league game that is due to be televised ? Forgive my ignorance on this, but as a season ticket holder, I've never bought a seat for an individual game at the bowl.

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OneBardGooner
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Re: CROWDFUNDING - REMOVE WENGER & KROENKE

Post by OneBardGooner »

NickF wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 6:17 pm
Rugby Gooner wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 6:11 pm
xisstential wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 5:08 pm
The enormity of the task is inside the ground, whether it be Wenger or Kroenke.. What I would be willing to do is get in with about 20 of us on one of those crappy Thursday nights, all with banners and kick up a helluva row for the entire match. We would somehow have to be together or at least in close proximity. 20 guys scattered around the stadium will be meaningless. I thought a Europa night because it might be easier to all get seats close to each other and from there we can ignite the crowd...Hopefully??? Outside the ground is hopeless, it doesn't get on TV...... beamed across the world is what I mean.
Any protest inside the bowl wouldn't last more than a minute.
"They" own the property,so would have it shut down post haste.
There would also be the AKB/Hipster?Tourists to contend with,and the stewards would side with them
Two seasons ago i would have agreed but last season there was very little opposition inside to protest. In fact i actually got more people saying "well done".

Good posts by Clash and Retro. All i would add is that i have no problem going after Kroenke by I'll be damned if I'm going to let Wenger off the hook.

Have to say i do like the idea of causing some mayhem at a Europa cup night.
I f someone is willing to pay (fund?) the fine, I'll happily run onto the pitch naked with a Wenger Out Banner! :D :barscarf: :barscarf: :barscarf:

General
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Re: CROWDFUNDING - REMOVE WENGER & KROENKE

Post by General »

When Wonga eventually pisses off whether back to France or upstairs, it would have such a monumental relieving effect on the club. It would be akin to toppling a political dictator who operated under a curfew and at last the populace can come out and enjoy life. Actually to put it simply, it would be like a blind man seeing for the first time. People should not underestimate how much this despicable prick is holding us back in every facet of the game and beyond. Some fans are guilty of looking too far into the future and speculating on what life post Wonga would look like. My view is that when the coont goes, live for today for tomorrow may never come. His departure won't solve every problem but it would set this club on the long road to recovery. We may never fully recover, who knows, but the *word censored* will be gone and some pride will be restored. This alone would be worth the celebration, safe in the knowledge that this football plague will never happen again.

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Re: CROWDFUNDING - REMOVE WENGER & KROENKE

Post by General »

--

xisstential
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Re: CROWDFUNDING - REMOVE WENGER & KROENKE

Post by xisstential »

NickF wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 6:17 pm
Rugby Gooner wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 6:11 pm
xisstential wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 5:08 pm
The enormity of the task is inside the ground, whether it be Wenger or Kroenke.. What I would be willing to do is get in with about 20 of us on one of those crappy Thursday nights, all with banners and kick up a helluva row for the entire match. We would somehow have to be together or at least in close proximity. 20 guys scattered around the stadium will be meaningless. I thought a Europa night because it might be easier to all get seats close to each other and from there we can ignite the crowd...Hopefully??? Outside the ground is hopeless, it doesn't get on TV...... beamed across the world is what I mean.
Any protest inside the bowl wouldn't last more than a minute.
"They" own the property,so would have it shut down post haste.
There would also be the AKB/Hipster?Tourists to contend with,and the stewards would side with them
Two seasons ago i would have agreed but last season there was very little opposition inside to protest. In fact i actually got more people saying "well done".

Good posts by Clash and Retro. All i would add is that i have no problem going after Kroenke by I'll be damned if I'm going to let Wenger off the hook.

Have to say i do like the idea of causing some mayhem at a Europa cup night.
EXACTLY!! I feel the same way...the feeling is there will be more takers to protest against Kroenke...and the Wengerites would join in going after Kroenke, too thick to realise that if Kroenke goes, Wenger will be booted out almost immediately by a new owner. Lets do both....at the last Protest we had ( Man.U) so many were willing to stand with us chanting anti Kroenke slogans. God but they are thick, they have convinced themselves Stan is holding Wenger back.

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DB10GOONER
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Re: CROWDFUNDING - REMOVE WENGER & KROENKE

Post by DB10GOONER »

xisstential wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2017 4:46 am
NickF wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 6:17 pm
Rugby Gooner wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 6:11 pm
xisstential wrote:
Tue Sep 12, 2017 5:08 pm
The enormity of the task is inside the ground, whether it be Wenger or Kroenke.. What I would be willing to do is get in with about 20 of us on one of those crappy Thursday nights, all with banners and kick up a helluva row for the entire match. We would somehow have to be together or at least in close proximity. 20 guys scattered around the stadium will be meaningless. I thought a Europa night because it might be easier to all get seats close to each other and from there we can ignite the crowd...Hopefully??? Outside the ground is hopeless, it doesn't get on TV...... beamed across the world is what I mean.
Any protest inside the bowl wouldn't last more than a minute.
"They" own the property,so would have it shut down post haste.
There would also be the AKB/Hipster?Tourists to contend with,and the stewards would side with them
Two seasons ago i would have agreed but last season there was very little opposition inside to protest. In fact i actually got more people saying "well done".

Good posts by Clash and Retro. All i would add is that i have no problem going after Kroenke by I'll be damned if I'm going to let Wenger off the hook.

Have to say i do like the idea of causing some mayhem at a Europa cup night.
EXACTLY!! I feel the same way...the feeling is there will be more takers to protest against Kroenke...and the Wengerites would join in going after Kroenke, too thick to realise that if Kroenke goes, Wenger will be booted out almost immediately by a new owner. Lets do both....at the last Protest we had ( Man.U) so many were willing to stand with us chanting anti Kroenke slogans. God but they are thick, they have convinced themselves Stan is holding Wenger back.
Maybe time to use their own stupidity against their Lord and Master?

Two superb posts from Clash and Retro. I said on here a couple of seasons ago I thought Kroenke "might" be the bigger problem and was assailed from all sides - even had one twat call me pro-Wenger! :oops: :lol: Then last season I became convinced Kroenke was the bigger problem as he, as the owner, was the only person with the power to not renew Wenger's contract, and yet he renewed it. I've said it repeatedly that the ambition of the club should be driven by the chairman or owner, they should set the tone and be ruthless in a footballing sense. Kroenke isn't and never will be. He's a businessman parasite.

In a way I view Kroenke as the disease and Wenger almost as a quite unpleasent and fatal symptom of that disease. I fully accept Wenger has more impact on the day to day illness affecting our once proud club but Wenger will not leave, he will not be driven out. So maybe we need to just take that on the chin and look at the bigger picture - getting Kroenke out and a new owner coming in seems the only way to get Wenger out. And hopefully a new owner that is a football man would sack Wenger immediately. I'm not saying that we can do that and I've no idea how we could except by maybe, as Retro says, hurting the "brand" so much that it makes Kroenke's continued ownership untenable in a financial sense? I don't have all the answers and don't pretend to.

I will say that anyone that thinks just getting rid of Wenger will push some magical reset button and we will go back to being Good Old Arsenal is not looking at or not seeing the bigger picture and is to a certain extent letting their (justified) dislike of Wenger cloud their perspective. Things will not get better just because Wenger is not manager. Kroenke will look to appoint another manager that is financially frugal and will probably do so with Wenger's advice. We are a business that dabbles in football. Kroenke as the owner has not only allowed this situation to fester, he has embraced it.

Wenger Out. Kroenke Out. But I believe we need Kroenke out to get Wenger out.

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augie
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Re: CROWDFUNDING - REMOVE WENGER & KROENKE

Post by augie »

DB10, do you think that (for example) ancellotti or diego simeone would do better with the squad we had last season ? Do you think that either would oversee back to back 5-1 maulings against Bayern ? Do you think that either would accept gutless performances that we seen at palace and the baggies last season ? Do you accept that giving his manager £100m to spend in summer of 2016 can be classed as kroenke supporting/backing his manager, and do you feel that the manager spent that money well ?

Kroenke is no good for our club. In the long term he will be a serious hinderance to our hopes of competing with the worlds best clubs. However he has backed a manager and given the c.unt plenty (too much) money in a bid to win the big trophies, so it is down to the total mismanagement and ineptitude of a senile c.unt manager that we are in the alarming mess we found ourselves in - yes he should fire the *word censored*, but the reality is that a top manager would do massively better with the resources available to him, and if so we wouldn't even be talking about kroenke's us franchises/new stadiums etc :roll:

xisstential
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Re: CROWDFUNDING - REMOVE WENGER & KROENKE

Post by xisstential »

DB everything you have said, we as the organizers, agree with. I think among a lot of the WOB (myself included) is this terrible reluctance to go after Kroenke alone as it looks like we are letting Wenger off the hook. And everyone wants to see Wenger driven out, hounded out in ignominy preferably.

I think we should target both and hopefully the groundswell will grow if Kroenke is the target as well. The AKB's if things are going badly on the field, will also want to vent and they would love to have somebody to target as a reason for Wenger's failures. Must be somebody else's, can't possibly be Wenger's fault, so they will be on the Kroenke thing like a rash. As I said, these morons don't realise any new owner with ambition will fire Wenger immediately.

Maybe the next plane should say Kroenke/Wenger OUT!!

As you say, the owner sets the standards and Kroenke has set a nice low bar and Wenger is happy to achieve just that. Tbh, in a footballing sense, I don't think Kroenke has set a bar height at all. The only way to get Kroenke's attention is to damage the worlds perception of the brand, to affect his profits. We need to figure out the best way to do that.

Isn't it ironic that the best person to ignite the fury of the fans is Wenger himself with his piss poor management "skills".

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Re: CROWDFUNDING - REMOVE WENGER & KROENKE

Post by DB10GOONER »

augie wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2017 9:51 am
DB10, do you think that (for example) ancellotti or diego simeone would do better with the squad we had last season ? Do you think that either would oversee back to back 5-1 maulings against Bayern ? Do you think that either would accept gutless performances that we seen at palace and the baggies last season ? Do you accept that giving his manager £100m to spend in summer of 2016 can be classed as kroenke supporting/backing his manager, and do you feel that the manager spent that money well ?

Kroenke is no good for our club. In the long term he will be a serious hinderance to our hopes of competing with the worlds best clubs. However he has backed a manager and given the c.unt plenty (too much) money in a bid to win the big trophies, so it is down to the total mismanagement and ineptitude of a senile c.unt manager that we are in the alarming mess we found ourselves in - yes he should fire the *word censored*, but the reality is that a top manager would do massively better with the resources available to him, and if so we wouldn't even be talking about kroenke's us franchises/new stadiums etc :roll:
Again, augie, with all due respect mate, I think you are slightly missing the elephant in the room. Obviously those managers would do better - ffs I would do better!! But why would Kroenke appoint Simeone or Ancellotti (he would not be my choice but anyway) or say Allegri? They are ambitious football men, not pretend economists. It's too simplistic to say Kroenke gave Wenger X amount to spend and that Wenger fucked it up by not spending it well. Kroenke released whatever he released money-wise of Arsenal money. And I'd bet my last cent he and Wenger had agreed that Wenger was never going to spend that amount. Look at our actual dealings;

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/arsenal ... /verein/11

According to that (yes, it's probably not acurate to the cent but it looks roughly right to me) we made a profit of possibly £14million.

Releasing Arsenal money to the Arsenal manager is not enough for an owner or chairman to do. It's the bare minimum. The owner, Kroenke, sets the tone. At Arsenal under Kroenke it is money first, football second. Wenger is his ideal manager - as proven by the ludicrous contract extension. Wenger will never spend £100million on players. Kroenke would simply look to appoint another "economist" as manager should Wenger leave. And I'd also bet my last cent that Wenger would have a big say in that appointment.

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Re: CROWDFUNDING - REMOVE WENGER & KROENKE

Post by DB10GOONER »

xisstential wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2017 10:12 am
DB everything you have said, we as the organizers, agree with. I think among a lot of the WOB (myself included) is this terrible reluctance to go after Kroenke alone as it looks like we are letting Wenger off the hook. And everyone wants to see Wenger driven out, hounded out in ignominy preferably.

I think we should target both and hopefully the groundswell will grow if Kroenke is the target as well. The AKB's if things are going badly on the field, will also want to vent and they would love to have somebody to target as a reason for Wenger's failures. Must be somebody else's, can't possibly be Wenger's fault, so they will be on the Kroenke thing like a rash. As I said, these morons don't realise any new owner with ambition will fire Wenger immediately.

Maybe the next plane should say Kroenke/Wenger OUT!!

As you say, the owner sets the standards and Kroenke has set a nice low bar and Wenger is happy to achieve just that. Tbh, in a footballing sense, I don't think Kroenke has set a bar height at all. The only way to get Kroenke's attention is to damage the worlds perception of the brand, to affect his profits. We need to figure out the best way to do that.

Isn't it ironic that the best person to ignite the fury of the fans is Wenger himself with his piss poor management "skills".
Agree 100% mate. And I don't envy you guys trying to figure this out.

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augie
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Re: CROWDFUNDING - REMOVE WENGER & KROENKE

Post by augie »

DB10GOONER wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2017 10:41 am
augie wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2017 9:51 am
DB10, do you think that (for example) ancellotti or diego simeone would do better with the squad we had last season ? Do you think that either would oversee back to back 5-1 maulings against Bayern ? Do you think that either would accept gutless performances that we seen at palace and the baggies last season ? Do you accept that giving his manager £100m to spend in summer of 2016 can be classed as kroenke supporting/backing his manager, and do you feel that the manager spent that money well ?

Kroenke is no good for our club. In the long term he will be a serious hinderance to our hopes of competing with the worlds best clubs. However he has backed a manager and given the c.unt plenty (too much) money in a bid to win the big trophies, so it is down to the total mismanagement and ineptitude of a senile c.unt manager that we are in the alarming mess we found ourselves in - yes he should fire the *word censored*, but the reality is that a top manager would do massively better with the resources available to him, and if so we wouldn't even be talking about kroenke's us franchises/new stadiums etc :roll:
Again, augie, with all due respect mate, I think you are slightly missing the elephant in the room. Obviously those managers would do better - ffs I would do better!! But why would Kroenke appoint Simeone or Ancellotti (he would not be my choice but anyway) or say Allegri? They are ambitious football men, not pretend economists. It's too simplistic to say Kroenke gave Wenger X amount to spend and that Wenger fucked it up by not spending it well. Kroenke released whatever he released money-wise of Arsenal money. And I'd bet my last cent he and Wenger had agreed that Wenger was never going to spend that amount. Look at our actual dealings;

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/arsenal ... /verein/11

According to that (yes, it's probably not acurate to the cent but it looks roughly right to me) we made a profit of possibly £14million.

Releasing Arsenal money to the Arsenal manager is not enough for an owner or chairman to do. It's the bare minimum. The owner, Kroenke, sets the tone. At Arsenal under Kroenke it is money first, football second. Wenger is his ideal manager - as proven by the ludicrous contract extension. Wenger will never spend £100million on players. Kroenke would simply look to appoint another "economist" as manager should Wenger leave. And I'd also bet my last cent that Wenger would have a big say in that appointment.



My point re the £100m transfer kitty wasn't that it came from kroenke's own pocket, but rather that le cock had the money and totally wasted it. We (the fans) have been consistant in our beliefs that the club should be generating enough money themselves to compete, so whether it came from kroenke's pocket or whether it came from players sales is irrelevant in the context of him pissing the money down the drain.

I'm not missing the elephant in the room at all - way, way back, I was one of the very few fans who was against selling out to kroenke, and I said it many times that I would have been more pro-usmanov. In an ideal scenario both of these *word censored*.s will fuck off at the end of this season (sooner would be better btw), but in the meantime I am totally convinced that getting rid of wenker would see a dramatic improvement on the playing side of the club regardless of who the owner is - whether our ***** owner (or the board) would have enough knowledge or acumen to appoint a suitable manager is an argument for another day, but I honestly believe that kroenke (for all his faults) is deferring to an outdated arrogant c.unt who is the one dictating how our club is being run

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Re: CROWDFUNDING - REMOVE WENGER & KROENKE

Post by DB10GOONER »

augie wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2017 11:06 am
DB10GOONER wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2017 10:41 am
augie wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2017 9:51 am
DB10, do you think that (for example) ancellotti or diego simeone would do better with the squad we had last season ? Do you think that either would oversee back to back 5-1 maulings against Bayern ? Do you think that either would accept gutless performances that we seen at palace and the baggies last season ? Do you accept that giving his manager £100m to spend in summer of 2016 can be classed as kroenke supporting/backing his manager, and do you feel that the manager spent that money well ?

Kroenke is no good for our club. In the long term he will be a serious hinderance to our hopes of competing with the worlds best clubs. However he has backed a manager and given the c.unt plenty (too much) money in a bid to win the big trophies, so it is down to the total mismanagement and ineptitude of a senile c.unt manager that we are in the alarming mess we found ourselves in - yes he should fire the *word censored*, but the reality is that a top manager would do massively better with the resources available to him, and if so we wouldn't even be talking about kroenke's us franchises/new stadiums etc :roll:
Again, augie, with all due respect mate, I think you are slightly missing the elephant in the room. Obviously those managers would do better - ffs I would do better!! But why would Kroenke appoint Simeone or Ancellotti (he would not be my choice but anyway) or say Allegri? They are ambitious football men, not pretend economists. It's too simplistic to say Kroenke gave Wenger X amount to spend and that Wenger fucked it up by not spending it well. Kroenke released whatever he released money-wise of Arsenal money. And I'd bet my last cent he and Wenger had agreed that Wenger was never going to spend that amount. Look at our actual dealings;

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/arsenal ... /verein/11

According to that (yes, it's probably not acurate to the cent but it looks roughly right to me) we made a profit of possibly £14million.

Releasing Arsenal money to the Arsenal manager is not enough for an owner or chairman to do. It's the bare minimum. The owner, Kroenke, sets the tone. At Arsenal under Kroenke it is money first, football second. Wenger is his ideal manager - as proven by the ludicrous contract extension. Wenger will never spend £100million on players. Kroenke would simply look to appoint another "economist" as manager should Wenger leave. And I'd also bet my last cent that Wenger would have a big say in that appointment.



My point re the £100m transfer kitty wasn't that it came from kroenke's own pocket, but rather that le cock had the money and totally wasted it. We (the fans) have been consistant in our beliefs that the club should be generating enough money themselves to compete, so whether it came from kroenke's pocket or whether it came from players sales is irrelevant in the context of him pissing the money down the drain.

I'm not missing the elephant in the room at all - way, way back, I was one of the very few fans who was against selling out to kroenke, and I said it many times that I would have been more pro-usmanov. In an ideal scenario both of these *word censored*.s will fuck off at the end of this season (sooner would be better btw), but in the meantime I am totally convinced that getting rid of wenker would see a dramatic improvement on the playing side of the club regardless of who the owner is - whether our ***** owner (or the board) would have enough knowledge or acumen to appoint a suitable manager is an argument for another day, but I honestly believe that kroenke (for all his faults) is deferring to an outdated arrogant c.unt who is the one dictating how our club is being run
To quote everyone's man of the year, Loooook... :lol: We'll have to agree to disagree as this just goes round in circles.

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