The 'I told you so' EU referendum - Officially the Worst Thread Ever

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Remain or leave

Remain
30
37%
Leave
51
63%
 
Total votes: 81

nut flush gooner
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Re: The 'I told you so' EU referendum - Officially the Worst Thread Ever

Post by nut flush gooner »

SPUDMASHER wrote:
Fri Feb 09, 2018 1:32 pm
About a page or so back I read this comment but I'm not sure who posted it :-

"The solution is quite simple, either levy a new tax where the highest earners make the biggest contribution or increase spending on the NHS. That won't happen unless Labour gets in mind."

Can I just say that kind of comment really fucks me off big time. Why does everyone in this country have an issue with people that have money?
There are two main ways that people have money, they either inherit it or they earn it. Either way they shouldn't be punished for having it. Further to that, there is already a levy where the higher earners pay more tax, it's called 40% rate ffs.

It's getting to a place in this country where 'wealthy' is considered a dirty word. Has it ever occurred to people that wealth is often a result of fucking hard work on behalf of the individual? Whatever happened to getting out what you put in? I totally accept that there are many people on low incomes that need additional support or haven't had opportunities that others have but that's just fucking life! Nobody said it was going to be easy and they certainly didn't say that everything would be equal.

How long is it before this hatred of everything wealthy results in a culture where people do not even attempt to improve their position because of the persecution that follows? If we carry on down this route the only outcome can be that there are no more wealthy people and then everyone will be royally fucked when they realise how much more those disgusting wealthy people already contribute.


rant over





p.s. No, I'm not wealthy, just comfortable....ish
I said it, and it was an observation rather than an opinion. It’s also factually correct, we need more funding for the nhs and if the money is going to come through taxation it works in a progressive way, ie you earn more you pay more. There’s no rocket science.

A11M11
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Re: The 'I told you so' EU referendum - Officially the Worst Thread Ever

Post by A11M11 »

The more you earn the more you pay , we already have two rates of taxation for Low and high earners. The government has money it's just how they choose to spend it.

nut flush gooner
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Re: The 'I told you so' EU referendum - Officially the Worst Thread Ever

Post by nut flush gooner »

A11M11 wrote:
Thu Feb 15, 2018 11:15 pm
The more you earn the more you pay , we already have two rates of taxation for Low and high earners. The government has money it's just how they choose to spend it.
That's a simplistic way of looking at things

The government is heavily in debt (£1900bn - Nov 17). They pay interest on their debts too. To pay more money for public services requires an increase in general taxation. That is a better option than borrowing more money. There are implications for the wider economy taking both routes.

A11M11
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Re: The 'I told you so' EU referendum - Officially the Worst Thread Ever

Post by A11M11 »

Might be simplistic but the government produces a budget taking the debts into account. You could raise the tax rates or bring low earners back into tax and make high earners pay more but over the years taxes designed to be spent on specifics tend to get lost in the general money pot and get spent on other things.
If you want to fund the NHS just take 50% of the lottery money , firstly if they said the cash goes to the NHS people that have grown tired of seeing the begging bowls of all sorts getting filled would start doing it again . The lottery produced money and all sorts of fringe ""good causes "" crept out of the woodwork and were awarded the spoils. However knowing the way the chancellor works . If a few billion found it's way to the NHS he would probably cut funding to spend it elsewhere.

nut flush gooner
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Re: The 'I told you so' EU referendum - Officially the Worst Thread Ever

Post by nut flush gooner »

A11M11 wrote:
Fri Feb 16, 2018 8:45 am
Might be simplistic but the government produces a budget taking the debts into account. You could raise the tax rates or bring low earners back into tax and make high earners pay more but over the years taxes designed to be spent on specifics tend to get lost in the general money pot and get spent on other things.
If you want to fund the NHS just take 50% of the lottery money , firstly if they said the cash goes to the NHS people that have grown tired of seeing the begging bowls of all sorts getting filled would start doing it again . The lottery produced money and all sorts of fringe ""good causes "" crept out of the woodwork and were awarded the spoils. However knowing the way the chancellor works . If a few billion found it's way to the NHS he would probably cut funding to spend it elsewhere.
The lottery is not run by the state but a private company?

Gunner Rob
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Re: The 'I told you so' EU referendum - Officially the Worst Thread Ever

Post by Gunner Rob »

of course as I have already stated if you want extra money for the NHS the easiest way to achieve that is to stop the Brexit process.

this is what it all comes down to again - you cannot have Brexit and a properly funded NHS.
Brexit will create a weaker economy in the UK - pretty much every study says so!!

maybe one day Brexiteers might believe one :roll:

A11M11
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Re: The 'I told you so' EU referendum - Officially the Worst Thread Ever

Post by A11M11 »

And continue to swell the coffers of the EU elite. Doesn't compute. Verhofsted has already said that if we cancel Article 50 , the rebates and such like that Thatcher worked for will be withdrawn . Which will actually leave us worse off.

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Re: The 'I told you so' EU referendum - Officially the Worst Thread Ever

Post by flash gunner »

Have we left yet?

Gunner Rob
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Re: The 'I told you so' EU referendum - Officially the Worst Thread Ever

Post by Gunner Rob »

flash gunner wrote:
Mon Feb 19, 2018 8:36 pm
Have we left yet?
no point in bothering now is there :popcorn:

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SPUDMASHER
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Re: The 'I told you so' EU referendum - Officially the Worst Thread Ever

Post by SPUDMASHER »

At the moment it appears that we'll be subject to all the same rules, will still have to pay the same contributions but just won't get a say in anything anymore. Top level negotiating on our part and a real success for the whole country. :barscarf: :barscarf: :roll:

Gunner Rob
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Re: The 'I told you so' EU referendum - Officially the Worst Thread Ever

Post by Gunner Rob »

SPUDMASHER wrote:
Thu Feb 22, 2018 8:15 am
At the moment it appears that we'll be subject to all the same rules, will still have to pay the same contributions but just won't get a say in anything anymore. Top level negotiating on our part and a real success for the whole country. :barscarf: :barscarf: :roll:
as I was saying not much point is there!
still will of the people and all that bollocks :rubchin:

A11M11
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Re: The 'I told you so' EU referendum - Officially the Worst Thread Ever

Post by A11M11 »

. Top level negotiating on our part and a real success for the whole country. :barscarf: :barscarf: :roll:



Our negotiations have been terrible. We went in allowing the EU to set the agenda and then seem to have allowed them to demand and us to capitulate throughout.
This of course is down to a few reasons , primarily that the people negotiating did not want the exit to happen in the first place and secondly because the lifeblood of the negotiators party were the very people that were complaining about the decision to go. The continual backbiting in our own position has weakened our hand and where there should have been a robust agenda set out we continued to fight the referendum over and over again and not move forward with any purpose.
I still believe that handled correctly Brexit will be the best thing for Britain to do in the long run , I never felt that it would be easy and I knew that there would be repercussions in the short term but always felt that once those problems were overcome the country would go forward and many of our social problems would improve. However it's been a total fuck up from the beginning , where we should have been strong and just said this is what we want , on one hand we have had people stating their case whilst behind their backs a different position has been touted by the people that won't accept the decision. It's been manna from heaven for Barnier , Junker and Verhofsted who have just laid their cards out and sat back whilst we fight amongst ourselves.

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Re: The 'I told you so' EU referendum - Officially the Worst Thread Ever

Post by Gunner Rob »

of course it might have been an idea for the Leave campaign to have actually had a plan in action once Brexit had been voted for NEARLY TWO YEARS AGO!

of course that was never going to happen because the Leave campaign was all based on LIES.
Had the truth been out there before the referendum then the majority of the people would not have been conned into voting for it.

as it stands it is a complete mess, but you have to remember this - the younger generation do not want Brexit and so even if it is implemented then they will reverse it when they take power in the future. the trouble is if we have to re enter the EU in the future it will be on much weaker terms.

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Re: The 'I told you so' EU referendum - Officially the Worst Thread Ever

Post by SPUDMASHER »

Gunner Rob wrote:
Thu Feb 22, 2018 10:54 am
of course it might have been an idea for the Leave campaign to have actually had a plan in action once Brexit had been voted for NEARLY TWO YEARS AGO!

of course that was never going to happen because the Leave campaign was all based on LIES.
Had the truth been out there before the referendum then the majority of the people would not have been conned into voting for it.


as it stands it is a complete mess, but you have to remember this - the younger generation do not want Brexit and so even if it is implemented then they will reverse it when they take power in the future. the trouble is if we have to re enter the EU in the future it will be on much weaker terms.
I'm not so sure it was Lies. I just think nobody really knew so they took a stab at a best guess at the possible outcomes.
The vote would not have changed as most people voted on the basis of two things:-
1. Johnny Foreigner coming and taking all of our jobs and sponging off the benefits whilst contributing nothing at all to the coffers and trying to change our culture.
2. The amount of money being paid out to the EU when our own public services are struggling.

Both those points were greatly inflated by the leave campaign and very loose connections were made to labour the point. Firstly how can you take all the jobs yet contribute nothing? If you're working you're paying tax. If you're not then your employer is to blame and should be exposed as the real reason we lose out. Secondly, our public services are struggling due to austerity not the EU. There is insufficient income for them to run as in the UK we all want Rolls Royce services but want to pay Skoda taxation for them. 2p in the £ sorts it out but any government suggesting so would be voted into the wilderness in an instant. We're too greedy (whilst criticising the rich) and can't see the hypocrisy of it all.

A11M11
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Re: The 'I told you so' EU referendum - Officially the Worst Thread Ever

Post by A11M11 »

If you're working you're paying tax.

Not neccesarily, If you are working 16 - 20 hours a week at minimum wage , you can claim benefit top ups and not enter the tax /Ni world,.

How many hand car washes where you live ? we seem to have one one every corner and supermarket car park.

As for the leave side not knowing what they wanted , actually they did, but their problem is that the negotiating team are in the main remainers . Hammond and his ilk have down everything they can to water down Brexit and have the support of Starmer and much of the labour party. May is bending in all directions trying to appease every faction of her party because she is avoiding the prospect of another election.
Claims on both sides were exaggerated , but the voice of real leavers is not being heard in the halls of power and certainly not in Westminster or Brussels.

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