Attack in London

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Herd
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Re: Attack in London

Post by Herd »

Its a horrible attack and I feel sorry for the Bobby but there are plenty of armed Police in the area and they should have got there quicker.

Its nice to see the outpouring of grief and shock and horror for the victims from the public too , but I ask you why the same public don't erupt in anguish when our governments kill innocent civilians in Iraq ,Syria ,Afghanistan .

The UK Government is responsible since the 1990's of hundreds of thousands of deaths and the utter destruction of these countries causing misery for millions and millions of people,yet we look the other way .

It is this blindness to the plight of others that ferments unease in people that can be exploited by the so called Islamist extremists.

You cannot make war with others and not expect them to make war with you !

Peace out !

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DB10GOONER
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Re: Attack in London

Post by DB10GOONER »

Herd wrote:Its a horrible attack and I feel sorry for the Bobby but there are plenty of armed Police in the area and they should have got there quicker.

Its nice to see the outpouring of grief and shock and horror for the victims from the public too , but I ask you why the same public don't erupt in anguish when our governments kill innocent civilians in Iraq ,Syria ,Afghanistan .

The UK Government is responsible since the 1990's of hundreds of thousands of deaths and the utter destruction of these countries causing misery for millions and millions of people,yet we look the other way .

It is this blindness to the plight of others that ferments unease in people that can be exploited by the so called Islamist extremists.

You cannot make war with others and not expect them to make war with you !

Peace out !
Great post Herd and very true.

To a certain extent this is what happens when countries become insular and don't embrace multi-culturalism. A large number of the population cease to care about what their government and military do in foreign countries. If you are mixing with people and have friends from (for EG) a Muslim country, then it hits closer to home when you hear your government just mistakenly dropped a bomb that wiped out 50 innocent people in a hospital in that country. You can put a personal face to the dead, you see that they had hopes and dreams, a family, kids to raise, just the same as you, because you see that in your friend.

Lack of cultural interaction can breed ignorance and ignorance breeds contempt. This perceived lack of a populace giving a shit about people dying in places like Syria, Iraq and Afghanistan then feeds the Islamic radical agenda and is gold to their recruiters as disenfranchised youth turn to them in the belief that the local populace in (again for EG) the UK don't care about them or view them as "lesser" people.

The (understandable) outpouring of grief and condolences after an event like the Westminster attack enforces that view among some of these disenfranchised youth particularly, as Herd says, when those same publicly grieving people don't feel the need to show the same remorse or sadness at the death of hundreds and thousands of people in those aforementioned countries.

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DB10GOONER
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Re: Attack in London

Post by DB10GOONER »

And apologies to RG for again dragging his well intentioned thread off topic again. Sorry, mate.

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flash gunner
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Re: Attack in London

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Until vast number of moderate muslims speak out against this then it will continue, currently their silence is deafening

Another person has died RIP to them all

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Herd
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Re: Attack in London

Post by Herd »

flash gunner wrote:Until vast number of moderate muslims speak out against this then it will continue, currently their silence is deafening

Another person has died RIP to them all
Utter rubbish Flash you've been caught in the hype !

their are plenty of muslims that are wholly against this stuff and have ZERO responsibility for it yet somehow they are required to stand up and do what exactly ?

Does anyone require church going Christians to stand up every time the UK goes on a bombing spree , no they do not !

If your neighbour stabs someone are you morally bound to denounce him because u live next door ,is it your fault ??

Of course it isnt !

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flash gunner
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Re: Attack in London

Post by flash gunner »

Herd wrote:
flash gunner wrote:Until vast number of moderate muslims speak out against this then it will continue, currently their silence is deafening

Another person has died RIP to them all
Utter rubbish Flash you've been caught in the hype !

their are plenty of muslims that are wholly against this stuff and have ZERO responsibility for it yet somehow they are required to stand up and do what exactly ?

Does anyone require church going Christians to stand up every time the UK goes on a bombing spree , no they do not !

If your neighbour stabs someone are you morally bound to denounce him because u live next door ,is it your fault ??

Of course it isnt !
No i havent been caught up Herd. I totally agree 100% that our actions in that part of the world has made things worse not better and any killings of innocent people in Syria, Iraq or London and Paris are equally vile and wrong......

These extremists do their killings on behalf of Islam the UK does not bomb on behalf of The Church of England so there is no need for Church going people to 'stand up' but many many do. The march against Tony Blairs Iraq war has millions of British people of all religions involved. Do you see this with Islamic people of any nationality. Im not sure they would make a difference but do they try?

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DB10GOONER
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Re: Attack in London

Post by DB10GOONER »

flash gunner wrote:
Herd wrote:
flash gunner wrote:Until vast number of moderate muslims speak out against this then it will continue, currently their silence is deafening

Another person has died RIP to them all
Utter rubbish Flash you've been caught in the hype !

their are plenty of muslims that are wholly against this stuff and have ZERO responsibility for it yet somehow they are required to stand up and do what exactly ?

Does anyone require church going Christians to stand up every time the UK goes on a bombing spree , no they do not !

If your neighbour stabs someone are you morally bound to denounce him because u live next door ,is it your fault ??

Of course it isnt !
No i havent been caught up Herd. I totally agree 100% that our actions in that part of the world has made things worse not better and any killings of innocent people in Syria, Iraq or London and Paris are equally vile and wrong......

These extremists do their killings on behalf of Islam the UK does not bomb on behalf of The Church of England so there is no need for Church going people to 'stand up' but many many do. The march against Tony Blairs Iraq war has millions of British people of all religions involved. Do you see this with Islamic people of any nationality. Im not sure they would make a difference but do they try?
I do agree that moderate Muslims do need to be more publicly vocal in denouncing these atrocities. But I would also say that many many moderate Muslims do a lot of hard work "behind the scenes" to try and stop their youth being radicalised and to temper the influence of radicals in Islamic schools for instance. And they have to be careful too, it must be remembered. If we stand up and criticise our governments for atrocities carried out in our name abroad, we are unlikely to be attacked or killed for doing so. Muslim moderates don't have the security of that, they are in real danger if they are perceived as a threat to the radicals. It's not as easy as them just standing up and being vocally critical of the fundamentalists.

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Re: Attack in London

Post by nut flush gooner »

Herd wrote:
flash gunner wrote:Until vast number of moderate muslims speak out against this then it will continue, currently their silence is deafening

Another person has died RIP to them all
Utter rubbish Flash you've been caught in the hype !

their are plenty of muslims that are wholly against this stuff and have ZERO responsibility for it yet somehow they are required to stand up and do what exactly ?

Does anyone require church going Christians to stand up every time the UK goes on a bombing spree , no they do not !

If your neighbour stabs someone are you morally bound to denounce him because u live next door ,is it your fault ??

Of course it isnt !
1001% spot on. Although I cannot verify this, I am sure it was exactly the same in the 70s/80s with moderate Catholics against the IRA. You can't vilify Muslims every time there is an attack on a different city. The moderates get a really rough ride from the likes of the Daily Mail in this country. And the unmentionable man of the people.

The bloke who carried out the attack name was Adrian Russell Ajao. He converted to Islam and was radicalised in Saudi Arabia. This just proves quite literally anyone who is not of sound mind, could end up carrying out such an atrocity.

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Rugby Gooner
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Re: Attack in London

Post by Rugby Gooner »

DB10GOONER wrote:And apologies to RG for again dragging his well intentioned thread off topic again. Sorry, mate.
Don't worry about it mate.Part of what make threads interesting is the way that they can meander and go off at tangents

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DB10GOONER
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Re: Attack in London

Post by DB10GOONER »

nut flush gooner wrote:
Herd wrote:
flash gunner wrote:Until vast number of moderate muslims speak out against this then it will continue, currently their silence is deafening

Another person has died RIP to them all
Utter rubbish Flash you've been caught in the hype !

their are plenty of muslims that are wholly against this stuff and have ZERO responsibility for it yet somehow they are required to stand up and do what exactly ?

Does anyone require church going Christians to stand up every time the UK goes on a bombing spree , no they do not !

If your neighbour stabs someone are you morally bound to denounce him because u live next door ,is it your fault ??

Of course it isnt !
1001% spot on. Although I cannot verify this, I am sure it was exactly the same in the 70s/80s with moderate Catholics against the IRA. You can't vilify Muslims every time there is an attack on a different city. The moderates get a really rough ride from the likes of the Daily Mail in this country. And the unmentionable man of the people.

The bloke who carried out the attack name was Adrian Russell Ajao. He converted to Islam and was radicalised in Saudi Arabia. This just proves quite literally anyone who is not of sound mind, could end up carrying out such an atrocity.
The vast vast majority of Irish people were against the IRA (and their Loyalist counterparts) but you had to be careful. I know of pubs back in the 80's and even the 90's in Dublin that if you had shot your mouth off against "The Lads" you would have gotten at least a serious beating and at worst possibly kneecapped. Ordinary people were loathe to publicly criticise those murdering fuckers because they were afraid.

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Re: Attack in London

Post by OneBardGooner »

nut flush gooner wrote:
Herd wrote:
flash gunner wrote:Until vast number of moderate muslims speak out against this then it will continue, currently their silence is deafening

Another person has died RIP to them all
Utter rubbish Flash you've been caught in the hype !

their are plenty of muslims that are wholly against this stuff and have ZERO responsibility for it yet somehow they are required to stand up and do what exactly ?

Does anyone require church going Christians to stand up every time the UK goes on a bombing spree , no they do not !

If your neighbour stabs someone are you morally bound to denounce him because u live next door ,is it your fault ??

Of course it isnt !
1001% spot on. Although I cannot verify this, I am sure it was exactly the same in the 70s/80s with moderate Catholics against the IRA. You can't vilify Muslims every time there is an attack on a different city. The moderates get a really rough ride from the likes of the Daily Mail in this country. And the unmentionable man of the people.

The bloke who carried out the attack name was Adrian Russell Ajao. He converted to Islam and was radicalised in Saudi Arabia. This just proves quite literally anyone who is not of sound mind, could end up carrying out such an atrocity.

:banghead: F F S - Can we have just One Thread without having Wenger mentioned! :roll:

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Herd
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Re: Attack in London

Post by Herd »


The vast vast majority of Irish people were against the IRA (and their Loyalist counterparts) but you had to be careful. I know of pubs back in the 80's and even the 90's in Dublin that if you had shot your mouth off against "The Lads" you would have gotten at least a serious beating and at worst possibly kneecapped. Ordinary people were loathe to publicly criticise those murdering fuckers because they were afraid.
This i know well
Last edited by Herd on Sat Mar 25, 2017 6:24 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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MrT
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Re: Attack in London

Post by MrT »

DB10GOONER wrote:
flash gunner wrote:
Herd wrote:
flash gunner wrote:Until vast number of moderate muslims speak out against this then it will continue, currently their silence is deafening

Another person has died RIP to them all
Utter rubbish Flash you've been caught in the hype !

their are plenty of muslims that are wholly against this stuff and have ZERO responsibility for it yet somehow they are required to stand up and do what exactly ?

Does anyone require church going Christians to stand up every time the UK goes on a bombing spree , no they do not !

If your neighbour stabs someone are you morally bound to denounce him because u live next door ,is it your fault ??

Of course it isnt !
No i havent been caught up Herd. I totally agree 100% that our actions in that part of the world has made things worse not better and any killings of innocent people in Syria, Iraq or London and Paris are equally vile and wrong......

These extremists do their killings on behalf of Islam the UK does not bomb on behalf of The Church of England so there is no need for Church going people to 'stand up' but many many do. The march against Tony Blairs Iraq war has millions of British people of all religions involved. Do you see this with Islamic people of any nationality. Im not sure they would make a difference but do they try?
I do agree that moderate Muslims do need to be more publicly vocal in denouncing these atrocities. But I would also say that many many moderate Muslims do a lot of hard work "behind the scenes" to try and stop their youth being radicalised and to temper the influence of radicals in Islamic schools for instance. And they have to be careful too, it must be remembered. If we stand up and criticise our governments for atrocities carried out in our name abroad, we are unlikely to be attacked or killed for doing so. Muslim moderates don't have the security of that, they are in real danger if they are perceived as a threat to the radicals. It's not as easy as them just standing up and being vocally critical of the fundamentalists.
Which once again shows Islam is incompatible with the west. What's stopping the 99.9% ( :lol: ) of ''moderate peaceful muslims'' from freely protesting against the radicals in their ranks? Nothing. The only Muslim rallies you see these days are the fundamentalists shitbags and the so called moderates are nowhere to be seen. You have the treacherous establishment who refuses to shut down Mosques and Islamic schools which spew anti-western rhetoric and police have their hands tied for fear of being accused of racism. The 1400 British girls molested by Muslim gangs in Rotherham which was allowed to go on for so long because of appeasement and political correctness makes me sick.

I don't think it's sunk in yet for many of you. Islam seeks domination under Sharia Law. It's written plainly in the Quran. Islam is not compatible with western ideals and never will be.

You want to know the difference between a moderate Muslim and a radical Muslim? The radical Muslim beheads non-believers and the moderate Muslim stands there and watches.

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AkneyGooner
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Re: Attack in London

Post by AkneyGooner »

I live in east london and have heard young muslim supporting the attacks sitting at a table in a takeway resturaunt

Watching videos of such things on thier phones etc, and is probably just stupidity of teenagers/young men more than anything but i do get a sense in some areas of london like bethnal green, that there is a bit of contempt felt towards non muslims by young muslims. Maybe one attitude helps shape the other i am not sure, but the guys on that table, whilst not being terrorists, they will not be going on any peace march i suspect


The strange part of it all is that they are very western in thier dress, culture but still have this hate at the same time, and of course on the other hand i worked with a muslim person at work, and did not even realise he was a muslim for nearly a year, until he mentioned it passing I had just asumed he was hindu, and after speaking with him, he hated the radical side of the relgion, infact he hated the idea of relgion being pushed on anyone unless it comes down from your parents.

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shu
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Re: Attack in London

Post by shu »

Twat face who keeps posting on here , the lefty Corbyn voter is probably one of them.

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