As we're unlikely to see terraces again at football, this is the virtual equivalent where you can chat to your hearts content about all football matters and, obviously, Arsenal in particular. This forum encourages all Gooners to visit and contribute so please keep it respectful, clean and topical.
Oh dear, straw men aplenty there Viv. All that after me praising you for being brave enough to define success.
You, Wilson, whoever else are perfectly entitled to your opinions and it's good to hear them, but when someone is so disparaging about the opinion of others and takes the banging of the pro Arteta drum to irrational levels, then it's fair to hold them to account and ask them to define success. You know as well as I do, that the reason Wilson avoids answering fair and straightforward questions is because he knows full well that the answers will, or might eventually, dismantle his position.
It's cowardice. Express your opinions for sure, but if you're going to be as strident and confrontational as Wilson has been, then at least have the courage of your convictions and not hide behind vague and weak notions of success.
For clarity Retro, I mean that 2nd and CL semi is progression. Ultimately success is winning one of the fuckers. Progression is acceptable.
And given the current footballing climate, in any other era this side would have a massive shout of winning the league. But today we live in a time where its ok for countries to bankroll football clubs, and give them a leg up and a platform to hire the best manager in the world. That's exactly what City has done. No matter what you think of Klopp as as person, he also is a decent coach.
Arteta has got Arsenal into a position, where the players would die for the badge these days. I look at this team and think, they get Arsenal. And its not just the home grown players, someone like Saliba who absolutely loves it when we score is a perfect example.
As you know, I need to see a lot more from our side before being convinced that Arteta is the answer and while I was happy for him to continue after last season, he really punctured my faith in him by not buying a striker, but spending 65 million on Havertz. That has installed a huge doubt that it will take quite a lot to shift..
Even if Arteta had done this we still would have needed to sign another midfielder you couldn’t go through a season relying on ESR as cover for Jorginho and’ Rice It would have been so lightweight in the middle.
That’s also ignoring that a striker would have cost more. Rasmus Hojlund cost 72 million as opposed to Havertz 58+ add ons. He had to sign Raya on loan because there was no money left. The money simply didn’t exist to do what you lost faith about. Even if we sold Nketiah it wouldn’t provide the budget we needed for the top class striker plus midfield addition. It just isn’t living in the real world
Blimey mate this is tiresome. Ok, we bought Declan Rice. I’m on record on the transfer thread saying that we still needed a solid centre mid, because I wanted us to sell Partey and I lacked confidence in Jorginho. However, I also said that the main priority was a top quality striker. If the funds were not available for both, then in my opinion the striker was paramount.
So, whether a striker and a midfielder, or only a striker, or only a midfielder, what we didn’t need was Kai fucking Havertz in any position. That’s why I lack faith in Arteta. We didn’t need Havertz at any cost, let alone 65 million.
We could have sold Eddie to Palace for 30 million, added the 65 and had 95 million to spend on a striker. That buys you a very good player.
Instead, we have Havertz who’s crap as either an advanced mid or a striker.
If we’d bought the striker and didn’t have funds to add a centre mid, then we could have played Trossard or ESR in the advanced mid role, both of whom are a mile in front of Havertz. We could even play Rice further forward and had a choice of Jorginho, Partey, or Elneny sitting deep. That’s 6 players to mix and match to fill 2 positions, which is doable even allowing for injuries. There was no need for Havertz.
So, last time, my faith in Arteta was seriously shaken by an enduring devotion to that donkey Xhaka and then by the inexplicable decision to buy the German dud who had categorically flopped in 3 years at Chelsea. Regardless of what our finances were, not a penny should have been spent on Havertz…in my opinion of course.
Fuck me.
Having re-read this, I need to add an edit….please don’t come back and say that I didn’t rate Partey or Jorginho, but then suggest playing them. Yep, because Havertz is a far worse option for the side. I’d like better than them, but we’ve added a total dud.
Simple solution ........ stop replying to him - I gave up trying to reason with him/them a while back cos to me he/they are either on a wind up or are too far gone to have rational debate with
For clarity Retro, I mean that 2nd and CL semi is progression. Ultimately success is winning one of the fuckers. Progression is acceptable.
And given the current footballing climate, in any other era this side would have a massive shout of winning the league. But today we live in a time where its ok for countries to bankroll football clubs, and give them a leg up and a platform to hire the best manager in the world. That's exactly what City has done. No matter what you think of Klopp as as person, he also is a decent coach.
Arteta has got Arsenal into a position, where the players would die for the badge these days. I look at this team and think, they get Arsenal. And its not just the home grown players, someone like Saliba who absolutely loves it when we score is a perfect example.
As you know, I need to see a lot more from our side before being convinced that Arteta is the answer and while I was happy for him to continue after last season, he really punctured my faith in him by not buying a striker, but spending 65 million on Havertz. That has installed a huge doubt that it will take quite a lot to shift..
Even if Arteta had done this we still would have needed to sign another midfielder you couldn’t go through a season relying on ESR as cover for Jorginho and’ Rice It would have been so lightweight in the middle.
That’s also ignoring that a striker would have cost more. Rasmus Hojlund cost 72 million as opposed to Havertz 58+ add ons. He had to sign Raya on loan because there was no money left. The money simply didn’t exist to do what you lost faith about. Even if we sold Nketiah it wouldn’t provide the budget we needed for the top class striker plus midfield addition. It just isn’t living in the real world
Blimey mate this is tiresome. Ok, we bought Declan Rice. I’m on record on the transfer thread saying that we still needed a solid centre mid, because I wanted us to sell Partey and I lacked confidence in Jorginho. However, I also said that the main priority was a top quality striker. If the funds were not available for both, then in my opinion the striker was paramount.
So, whether a striker and a midfielder, or only a striker, or only a midfielder, what we didn’t need was Kai fucking Havertz in any position. That’s why I lack faith in Arteta. We didn’t need Havertz at any cost, let alone 65 million.
We could have sold Eddie to Palace for 30 million, added the 65 and had 95 million to spend on a striker. That buys you a very good player.
Instead, we have Havertz who’s crap as either an advanced mid or a striker.
If we’d bought the striker and didn’t have funds to add a centre mid, then we could have played Trossard or ESR in the advanced mid role, both of whom are a mile in front of Havertz. We could even play Rice further forward and had a choice of Jorginho, Partey, or Elneny sitting deep. That’s 6 players to mix and match to fill 2 positions, which is doable even allowing for injuries. There was no need for Havertz.
So, last time, my faith in Arteta was seriously shaken by an enduring devotion to that donkey Xhaka and then by the inexplicable decision to buy the German dud who had categorically flopped in 3 years at Chelsea. Regardless of what our finances were, not a penny should have been spent on Havertz…in my opinion of course.
Fuck me.
Having re-read this, I need to add an edit….please don’t come back and say that I didn’t rate Partey or Jorginho, but then suggest playing them. Yep, because Havertz is a far worse option for the side. I’d like better than them, but we’ve added a total dud.
Simple solution ........ stop replying to him - I gave up trying to reason with him/them a while back cos to me he/they are either on a wind up or are too far gone to have rational debate with
You're right of course augie and I know it, so need to stop taking the bait. There's a couple where I think it's genuine disagreement rather than a wind up, so that's fine, it's what the forum is about, but there's a couple of others who are wind up merchants and deliberately misrepresent what is said to them and seem to think we're all too stupid to notice.
Prime example the other day was one of them making a lame excuse for our recent league cup failures by saying that we were unlucky to be drawn away to two London clubs in consecutive seasons. Apart from that being as weak an excuse as one could dream up, it had already been mentioned that one of those losses was against Brighton (which was at home!). So he's either beyond clueless, or was deliberately putting a fake spin on something in the hope it wouldn't be noticed. Of course, when it's pointed out to him, there's no acknowledgement that he got it wrong. WUM.
As you know, I need to see a lot more from our side before being convinced that Arteta is the answer and while I was happy for him to continue after last season, he really punctured my faith in him by not buying a striker, but spending 65 million on Havertz. That has installed a huge doubt that it will take quite a lot to shift..
Even if Arteta had done this we still would have needed to sign another midfielder you couldn’t go through a season relying on ESR as cover for Jorginho and’ Rice It would have been so lightweight in the middle.
That’s also ignoring that a striker would have cost more. Rasmus Hojlund cost 72 million as opposed to Havertz 58+ add ons. He had to sign Raya on loan because there was no money left. The money simply didn’t exist to do what you lost faith about. Even if we sold Nketiah it wouldn’t provide the budget we needed for the top class striker plus midfield addition. It just isn’t living in the real world
Blimey mate this is tiresome. Ok, we bought Declan Rice. I’m on record on the transfer thread saying that we still needed a solid centre mid, because I wanted us to sell Partey and I lacked confidence in Jorginho. However, I also said that the main priority was a top quality striker. If the funds were not available for both, then in my opinion the striker was paramount.
So, whether a striker and a midfielder, or only a striker, or only a midfielder, what we didn’t need was Kai fucking Havertz in any position. That’s why I lack faith in Arteta. We didn’t need Havertz at any cost, let alone 65 million.
We could have sold Eddie to Palace for 30 million, added the 65 and had 95 million to spend on a striker. That buys you a very good player.
Instead, we have Havertz who’s crap as either an advanced mid or a striker.
If we’d bought the striker and didn’t have funds to add a centre mid, then we could have played Trossard or ESR in the advanced mid role, both of whom are a mile in front of Havertz. We could even play Rice further forward and had a choice of Jorginho, Partey, or Elneny sitting deep. That’s 6 players to mix and match to fill 2 positions, which is doable even allowing for injuries. There was no need for Havertz.
So, last time, my faith in Arteta was seriously shaken by an enduring devotion to that donkey Xhaka and then by the inexplicable decision to buy the German dud who had categorically flopped in 3 years at Chelsea. Regardless of what our finances were, not a penny should have been spent on Havertz…in my opinion of course.
Fuck me.
Having re-read this, I need to add an edit….please don’t come back and say that I didn’t rate Partey or Jorginho, but then suggest playing them. Yep, because Havertz is a far worse option for the side. I’d like better than them, but we’ve added a total dud.
Simple solution ........ stop replying to him - I gave up trying to reason with him/them a while back cos to me he/they are either on a wind up or are too far gone to have rational debate with
You're right of course augie and I know it, so need to stop taking the bait. There's a couple where I think it's genuine disagreement rather than a wind up, so that's fine, it's what the forum is about, but there's a couple of others who are wind up merchants and deliberately misrepresent what is said to them and seem to think we're all too stupid to notice.
Prime example the other day was one of them making a lame excuse for our recent league cup failures by saying that we were unlucky to be drawn away to two London clubs in consecutive seasons. Apart from that being as weak an excuse as one could dream up, it had already been mentioned that one of those losses was against Brighton (which was at home!). So he's either beyond clueless, or was deliberately putting a fake spin on something in the hope it wouldn't be noticed. Of course, when it's pointed out to him, there's no acknowledgement that he got it wrong. WUM.
He only joined a month ago by the look of it...spins everything...never takes into account anything...he has an agenda to disrupt
i actually went on forum to state i would not change arteta and delighted at present...he somehow spins it opposite...
Dont quite think he realises its a FORUM with all differing views expressed
Even if Arteta had done this we still would have needed to sign another midfielder you couldn’t go through a season relying on ESR as cover for Jorginho and’ Rice It would have been so lightweight in the middle.
That’s also ignoring that a striker would have cost more. Rasmus Hojlund cost 72 million as opposed to Havertz 58+ add ons. He had to sign Raya on loan because there was no money left. The money simply didn’t exist to do what you lost faith about. Even if we sold Nketiah it wouldn’t provide the budget we needed for the top class striker plus midfield addition. It just isn’t living in the real world
Blimey mate this is tiresome. Ok, we bought Declan Rice. I’m on record on the transfer thread saying that we still needed a solid centre mid, because I wanted us to sell Partey and I lacked confidence in Jorginho. However, I also said that the main priority was a top quality striker. If the funds were not available for both, then in my opinion the striker was paramount.
So, whether a striker and a midfielder, or only a striker, or only a midfielder, what we didn’t need was Kai fucking Havertz in any position. That’s why I lack faith in Arteta. We didn’t need Havertz at any cost, let alone 65 million.
We could have sold Eddie to Palace for 30 million, added the 65 and had 95 million to spend on a striker. That buys you a very good player.
Instead, we have Havertz who’s crap as either an advanced mid or a striker.
If we’d bought the striker and didn’t have funds to add a centre mid, then we could have played Trossard or ESR in the advanced mid role, both of whom are a mile in front of Havertz. We could even play Rice further forward and had a choice of Jorginho, Partey, or Elneny sitting deep. That’s 6 players to mix and match to fill 2 positions, which is doable even allowing for injuries. There was no need for Havertz.
So, last time, my faith in Arteta was seriously shaken by an enduring devotion to that donkey Xhaka and then by the inexplicable decision to buy the German dud who had categorically flopped in 3 years at Chelsea. Regardless of what our finances were, not a penny should have been spent on Havertz…in my opinion of course.
Fuck me.
Having re-read this, I need to add an edit….please don’t come back and say that I didn’t rate Partey or Jorginho, but then suggest playing them. Yep, because Havertz is a far worse option for the side. I’d like better than them, but we’ve added a total dud.
Simple solution ........ stop replying to him - I gave up trying to reason with him/them a while back cos to me he/they are either on a wind up or are too far gone to have rational debate with
You're right of course augie and I know it, so need to stop taking the bait. There's a couple where I think it's genuine disagreement rather than a wind up, so that's fine, it's what the forum is about, but there's a couple of others who are wind up merchants and deliberately misrepresent what is said to them and seem to think we're all too stupid to notice.
Prime example the other day was one of them making a lame excuse for our recent league cup failures by saying that we were unlucky to be drawn away to two London clubs in consecutive seasons. Apart from that being as weak an excuse as one could dream up, it had already been mentioned that one of those losses was against Brighton (which was at home!). So he's either beyond clueless, or was deliberately putting a fake spin on something in the hope it wouldn't be noticed. Of course, when it's pointed out to him, there's no acknowledgement that he got it wrong. WUM.
He only joined a month ago by the look of it...spins everything...never takes into account anything...he has an agenda to disrupt
i actually went on forum to state i would not change arteta and delighted at present...he somehow spins it opposite...
Dont quite think he realises its a FORUM with all differing views expressed
Try not to be so sensitive. I can accept different views especially from an old school fan been around the block but I’m interested in why people jump to extremes. With you I was just interested in your opinion as to why the manager has favourites really because the guy seems pretty ruthless as far as I can see. Arteta wasn’t mentioned at all I didn’t call you out on it read it again. This suggestion on favourites was being trotted out a lot and I wanted to know who it meant. I can’t agree he doesn’t like Martinelli though. Total nonsense however it’s interesting to read whilst not holding much truth.
I don’t understand the Kai Havertz hate cult I’ll be honest. I know this isn’t you either mate, The notion you have to pretend a player isn’t playing well when he is. If he has a quiet game like earlier in the season abuse him, Play well then grab that spinning totem and abuse him anyway as the totem continues spinning in a parallel state of conscious you have created inside your head because you wrote him off.
Blimey mate this is tiresome. Ok, we bought Declan Rice. I’m on record on the transfer thread saying that we still needed a solid centre mid, because I wanted us to sell Partey and I lacked confidence in Jorginho. However, I also said that the main priority was a top quality striker. If the funds were not available for both, then in my opinion the striker was paramount.
So, whether a striker and a midfielder, or only a striker, or only a midfielder, what we didn’t need was Kai fucking Havertz in any position. That’s why I lack faith in Arteta. We didn’t need Havertz at any cost, let alone 65 million.
We could have sold Eddie to Palace for 30 million, added the 65 and had 95 million to spend on a striker. That buys you a very good player.
Instead, we have Havertz who’s crap as either an advanced mid or a striker.
If we’d bought the striker and didn’t have funds to add a centre mid, then we could have played Trossard or ESR in the advanced mid role, both of whom are a mile in front of Havertz. We could even play Rice further forward and had a choice of Jorginho, Partey, or Elneny sitting deep. That’s 6 players to mix and match to fill 2 positions, which is doable even allowing for injuries. There was no need for Havertz.
So, last time, my faith in Arteta was seriously shaken by an enduring devotion to that donkey Xhaka and then by the inexplicable decision to buy the German dud who had categorically flopped in 3 years at Chelsea. Regardless of what our finances were, not a penny should have been spent on Havertz…in my opinion of course.
Fuck me.
Having re-read this, I need to add an edit….please don’t come back and say that I didn’t rate Partey or Jorginho, but then suggest playing them. Yep, because Havertz is a far worse option for the side. I’d like better than them, but we’ve added a total dud.
Simple solution ........ stop replying to him - I gave up trying to reason with him/them a while back cos to me he/they are either on a wind up or are too far gone to have rational debate with
You're right of course augie and I know it, so need to stop taking the bait. There's a couple where I think it's genuine disagreement rather than a wind up, so that's fine, it's what the forum is about, but there's a couple of others who are wind up merchants and deliberately misrepresent what is said to them and seem to think we're all too stupid to notice.
Prime example the other day was one of them making a lame excuse for our recent league cup failures by saying that we were unlucky to be drawn away to two London clubs in consecutive seasons. Apart from that being as weak an excuse as one could dream up, it had already been mentioned that one of those losses was against Brighton (which was at home!). So he's either beyond clueless, or was deliberately putting a fake spin on something in the hope it wouldn't be noticed. Of course, when it's pointed out to him, there's no acknowledgement that he got it wrong. WUM.
He only joined a month ago by the look of it...spins everything...never takes into account anything...he has an agenda to disrupt
i actually went on forum to state i would not change arteta and delighted at present...he somehow spins it opposite...
Dont quite think he realises its a FORUM with all differing views expressed
Try not to be so sensitive. I can accept different views especially from an old school fan been around the block but I’m interested in why people jump to extremes. With you I was just interested in your opinion as to why the manager has favourites really because the guy seems pretty ruthless as far as I can see. Arteta wasn’t mentioned at all I didn’t call you out on it read it again. This suggestion on favourites was being trotted out a lot and I wanted to know who it meant. I can’t agree he doesn’t like Martinelli though. Total nonsense however it’s interesting to read whilst not holding much truth.
I don’t understand the Kai Havertz hate cult I’ll be honest. I know this isn’t you either mate, The notion you have to pretend a player isn’t playing well when he is. If he has a quiet game like earlier in the season abuse him, Play well then grab that spinning totem and abuse him anyway as the totem continues spinning in a parallel state of conscious you have created inside your head because you wrote him off.
True. We'll be ok next season because we'll sell Rambo, Eddie, Nelson and ESR, obviously the latter 3 being pure profit so we should get around
35m - Rambo
15m - The Feather
12m - Half Nelson
25m - ESR
20m - Partey
Maybe another 20m for Tierney before he sprains his wrist signing a contract for someone.......
So maybe 120-130m from sales?
Best thing of all is close to 100m guaranteed for the CL performance this season......and that's BEFORE we get to the semi's!!
This, as a lot of them are home grown its pure profit on the books. Any big signing will be amortised over the duration of the contract, so only appear on the books in the next accounting year as a fraction of the actual transfer value. So its quite simple, sell and we can buy. There's an easy £100m in sales.
So Arteta has taken 4 points off Klopp's Liverpool and Pep's City and they only have a point against us. Plus Arteta beat pep in the community shield. We are now competing in every big occasion.
Plus we are breaking records. First team to score 2+ goals in eight consecutive halves of Premier League football and also the first team in English top-flight history to win three straight games by a 5+ goal margin. Broke our own record for scoring from set pieces in a season.
Time to acknowledge Mikel is the best young coach in world football and give him the credit he deserves. Totally reversed our fortunes.
So Arteta has taken 4 points off Klopp's Liverpool and Pep's City and they only have a point against us. Plus Arteta beat pep in the community shield. We are now competing in every big occasion.
Plus we are breaking records. First team to score 2+ goals in eight consecutive halves of Premier League football and also the first team in English top-flight history to win three straight games by a 5+ goal margin. Broke our own record for scoring from set pieces in a season.
Time to acknowledge Mikel is the best young coach in world football and give him the credit he deserves. Totally reversed our fortunes.
He has definitely got us competing again.
However let’s see how the end of season goes before getting carried away shall we ? He still hasn’t won anything much - the last 2 Arsenal managers in post for as long as Arteta has had won league titles within 3 years.
I still don’t see us winning the league this season - the lack of a top quality goal scorer will cost us in the end (something which should have been addressed last summer). Defensively he deserves some plaudits though - we once again have the best defence in the country and it’s great to see.
So Arteta has taken 4 points off Klopp's Liverpool and Pep's City and they only have a point against us. Plus Arteta beat pep in the community shield. We are now competing in every big occasion.
Plus we are breaking records. First team to score 2+ goals in eight consecutive halves of Premier League football and also the first team in English top-flight history to win three straight games by a 5+ goal margin. Broke our own record for scoring from set pieces in a season.
Time to acknowledge Mikel is the best young coach in world football and give him the credit he deserves. Totally reversed our fortunes.
He has definitely got us competing again.
However let’s see how the end of season goes before getting carried away shall we ? He still hasn’t won anything much - the last 2 Arsenal managers in post for as long as Arteta has had won league titles within 3 years.
I still don’t see us winning the league this season - the lack of a top quality goal scorer will cost us in the end (something which should have been addressed last summer). Defensively he deserves some plaudits though - we once again have the best defence in the country and it’s great to see.
The irony is that he didnt want saliba and bought ben white to play centre back The double irony is that after last seasons collapse he realised that he cant survive without saliba and he then tried to squeeze gabriel out at the start of this season and didnt pick him for the first few games
If he wins the league this season then it goes up there in the history of the club as one of its greatest ever achievements. Wenger transformed the club in 1996 and broke Man United's dominance, but it really was the dominance of one club only with a brief bit of 'steel cash' thrown in by Blackburn which disappeared as soon as it arrived. The Liverpool team that finished 3rd in Wenger's first title winning season lost 9 games and ended up with 65 points. The Chavs lost 15 and finished 4th !!
Roll forward to 2002 - 3rd placed Man Ure lost 9 games, 4th placed Newcastle also 9. The top 3 between them have lost 9 games this season and arguably won't lose any more.
The Invincibles had the title wrapped up with games to spare, before the Chavs finished a distant 2nd losing 7 games. Their record of 90 points would have won last season's league by a single point, they would have finished 3rd in 2022, 4 points clear in 2021, runners up by 9 points in 2020, and third in 2019 (trailing the runners up by 7 points!).
The standards of the top 3 are now off the scale. It isn't just beating Man Ure once every other season or four.....its about competing with teams that have some of the best talents in world football and where the average number of points it takes to win a title is 93.....three more points than our greatest team in history ever managed.
I have been as critical as anyone about Arteta. I think he was a very lucky boy during the COVID times and has had the backing that no Arsenal manager before him has ever enjoyed. But despite all of that it takes something extra extra special to win the PL these days - way more than the brain dead days of English football in the 90s when managers like Big Ron and Fat Sam were still favoured by many an Ingerlish chairman!
One thing I would add, is that football is still about enjoyment and entertainment, and at various points over the last 15 years, I've had spells of feeling almost completely disconnected from the Arsenal. Defeats (rinsings at that) were just like water off a duck's back at the end, the odd brief flirtation with the top of the table was 'meh' because it was absolutely nailed on that the mother of all collapses would set in. I hated the CL because we simply didn't have the minerals for it, and in the end I preferred the Europa League just for the chance of seeing us win a few games and visit a few new places. The CL is still under review as I still think (as City and the Chavs proved) it takes a while of consistently being it before it gets mastered. In terms of the enjoyment though, I actually look forward to our games once more. At its worst, I'd just go out for the day and in some cases even forget who we were playing - something I hadn't known at any point. Arteta has helped to bring some enjoyment back and a connection with the fans. I'm a Gen X so not sure all the fireworks, light shows and blokes dressed in black from head to toe, are for me, but they aren't intended to be for me....they are for those coming through, and it is creating a better vibe in the stadium than I've known for a long while.
If he wins the league this season then it goes up there in the history of the club as one of its greatest ever achievements. Wenger transformed the club in 1996 and broke Man United's dominance, but it really was the dominance of one club only with a brief bit of 'steel cash' thrown in by Blackburn which disappeared as soon as it arrived. The Liverpool team that finished 3rd in Wenger's first title winning season lost 9 games and ended up with 65 points. The Chavs lost 15 and finished 4th !!
Roll forward to 2002 - 3rd placed Man Ure lost 9 games, 4th placed Newcastle also 9. The top 3 between them have lost 9 games this season and arguably won't lose any more.
The Invincibles had the title wrapped up with games to spare, before the Chavs finished a distant 2nd losing 7 games. Their record of 90 points would have won last season's league by a single point, they would have finished 3rd in 2022, 4 points clear in 2021, runners up by 9 points in 2020, and third in 2019 (trailing the runners up by 7 points!).
The standards of the top 3 are now off the scale. It isn't just beating Man Ure once every other season or four.....its about competing with teams that have some of the best talents in world football and where the average number of points it takes to win a title is 93.....three more points than our greatest team in history ever managed.
I have been as critical as anyone about Arteta. I think he was a very lucky boy during the COVID times and has had the backing that no Arsenal manager before him has ever enjoyed. But despite all of that it takes something extra extra special to win the PL these days - way more than the brain dead days of English football in the 90s when managers like Big Ron and Fat Sam were still favoured by many an Ingerlish chairman!
As an established "oldie" Steve O, I prefer to go by what my eyes tell me more than what the stats say - so forgetting things like pts, league tables and opposition teams, I look at this AFC team and I have to say that there is no way it is as good a team as title winning GG teams, and it isnt fit to be in the same park as the title winning wenger teams in terms of quality. There is no Bergkamp, no TA6, no PV4, no Henry or no seaman in this team. That being said, all any team can do is be the best in their own league, and if we win the league I wont care that this is not as good a team as previous AFC league winners, however what your stats from bygone era's conveniently ignores is the difference that money has made to the gap between the big clubs and the rest - reality is that every season these clubs are receiving huge money for european qualification and if they are getting that money year after year, then obviously the gap is going to get wider and wider domestically, and hence the big clubs will lose fewer games to the smaller teams nowadays.
If he wins the league this season then it goes up there in the history of the club as one of its greatest ever achievements. Wenger transformed the club in 1996 and broke Man United's dominance, but it really was the dominance of one club only with a brief bit of 'steel cash' thrown in by Blackburn which disappeared as soon as it arrived. The Liverpool team that finished 3rd in Wenger's first title winning season lost 9 games and ended up with 65 points. The Chavs lost 15 and finished 4th !!
Roll forward to 2002 - 3rd placed Man Ure lost 9 games, 4th placed Newcastle also 9. The top 3 between them have lost 9 games this season and arguably won't lose any more.
The Invincibles had the title wrapped up with games to spare, before the Chavs finished a distant 2nd losing 7 games. Their record of 90 points would have won last season's league by a single point, they would have finished 3rd in 2022, 4 points clear in 2021, runners up by 9 points in 2020, and third in 2019 (trailing the runners up by 7 points!).
The standards of the top 3 are now off the scale. It isn't just beating Man Ure once every other season or four.....its about competing with teams that have some of the best talents in world football and where the average number of points it takes to win a title is 93.....three more points than our greatest team in history ever managed.
I have been as critical as anyone about Arteta. I think he was a very lucky boy during the COVID times and has had the backing that no Arsenal manager before him has ever enjoyed. But despite all of that it takes something extra extra special to win the PL these days - way more than the brain dead days of English football in the 90s when managers like Big Ron and Fat Sam were still favoured by many an Ingerlish chairman!
As an established "oldie" Steve O, I prefer to go by what my eyes tell me more than what the stats say - so forgetting things like pts, league tables and opposition teams, I look at this AFC team and I have to say that there is no way it is as good a team as title winning GG teams, and it isnt fit to be in the same park as the title winning wenger teams in terms of quality. There is no Bergkamp, no TA6, no PV4, no Henry or no seaman in this team. That being said, all any team can do is be the best in their own league, and if we win the league I wont care that this is not as good a team as previous AFC league winners, however what your stats from bygone era's conveniently ignores is the difference that money has made to the gap between the big clubs and the rest - reality is that every season these clubs are receiving huge money for european qualification and if they are getting that money year after year, then obviously the gap is going to get wider and wider domestically, and hence the big clubs will lose fewer games to the smaller teams nowadays.
On the contrary - the gap between Manchester United's wealth back then and the teams in mid table was as vast as it ever got. These days you've got Bournemouth spending £40m on a player and in fact you'll find the whole reason behind the proposed breakaway for the European Super League was because the greedy c.unts at the top were complaining that they deserved a bigger share of the spoils. The team in 7th, West Ham, sold us a player for £105m - not because they needed too, but because he wanted out. They get 60000+ crowds every week. Newcastle in 8th spent £60m on Isak and are amonst the richest clubs in the world. The Chavs have spent £1bn and are 11th. In 1998, Derby finished 9th and Coventry 11th! The gap was way bigger then than it is now - a league full of Ingerlish neanderthals back then. Was a dire standard
So Arteta has taken 4 points off Klopp's Liverpool and Pep's City and they only have a point against us. Plus Arteta beat pep in the community shield. We are now competing in every big occasion.
Plus we are breaking records. First team to score 2+ goals in eight consecutive halves of Premier League football and also the first team in English top-flight history to win three straight games by a 5+ goal margin. Broke our own record for scoring from set pieces in a season.
Time to acknowledge Mikel is the best young coach in world football and give him the credit he deserves. Totally reversed our fortunes.
He has definitely got us competing again.
However let’s see how the end of season goes before getting carried away shall we ? He still hasn’t won anything much - the last 2 Arsenal managers in post for as long as Arteta has had won league titles within 3 years.
I still don’t see us winning the league this season - the lack of a top quality goal scorer will cost us in the end (something which should have been addressed last summer). Defensively he deserves some plaudits though - we once again have the best defence in the country and it’s great to see.
I’m not really getting carried away and like you don’t see us winning the league, we blew it dropping those points against Fulham away and especially home and let it slip v spurs.
However I’m not in the camp that I need to see what happens at the end of the season. If we won a load of games and fall short ultimately I wouldn’t see that as any reason to change anything or being upset with the direction we are headed in. These are pretty small margins. Absolutely loved our centre backs shithousing mongo on Sunday. Something that reminded me a bit of Adams and Bouldy.
