Just Who Is Arsenal's Greatest Ever Manager?

[rolypoly]

for those who praised george graham and included cup winners runners up in 1995 as one of his achievements, you need reminding that

1. he had been sacked by arsenal before quarter-finals of 95 euro campaign

2. he was sacked for corruption

3. the corruption purchasing players eg lydersen in order to line his pockets irrespective of whether or not in club`s best interests

4. he destroyed attractive midfield which inc thomas rocastle and davis the latter of whom was banished to reserves for daring to have independent mind and only brought back in 94 when graham desperate

5 in their place introduced us to the wonders of mcgoldprick, selley, morrow, hillier, jensen

6 he ruined smudger and campbell by over reliance on wright as a consequence of which team as a whole scored less goals than before wright joined

7. he took us from championship winners and challengers to absolute no-hopers in his last two and a half league campaigns

8. his style of football changed from attractive to boring everyone to death inc his own fans-1-0 to the arsenal is not a song of triumph its a witty self -mocking parody acknowledging just how boring we had become.

9. wenger for all his faults has never to the best of my knowledge acted corruptly and wilfully to the detriment of the club and that he is well rewarded compared to graham is no excuse for graham who by comparison with your average gooner did quite nicely without bungs.

10. chapman made arsenal world famous; wenger has made arsenal famous and fantastically popular due to success and brand of football; both have left long-lasting and enduring legacies; 1994 copenhagen was wonderful for all gooners but the rest of the world would have looked on in horror as graham`s anti- football won the day; if graham was a manager today, he`d be managing stoke and loving it.

[augie]

GG for me, he didn't inherit anywhere near the quality Wenger did. I still say a Wenger team no matter how good it was, would never have got a result at Anfield on that great night. As for chapman, we are talking a completely different era so it would be impossible for me to judge.

Absolutely agree with your statement on the squad wenger inherited - imagine the mess a new manager would have to sort out with the squad wenger has accumulated

[augie]

for those who praised george graham and included cup winners runners up in 1995 as one of his achievements, you need reminding that

1. he had been sacked by arsenal before quarter-finals of 95 euro campaign

2. he was sacked for corruption


3. the corruption purchasing players eg lydersen in order to line his pockets irrespective of whether or not in club`s
best interests
Bullshit - an independent inquiry concluded that GG absolutely bought lyderson cos he rated him as a
player
4. he destroyed attractive midfield which inc thomas rocastle and davis the latter of whom was banished to reserves for daring to have independent mind and only brought back in 94 when graham desperate

5 in their place introduced us to the wonders of mcgoldprick, selley, morrow, hillier, jensen
Let me introduce you to stepanovs,almunia,flaps,song,chamakh and there are far more if you want

6 he ruined smudger and campbell by over reliance on wright as a consequence of which team as a whole scored less goals than before wright joined
Wenger took a quality player like arshavin and destroyed him by playing him as a winger

7. he took us from championship winners and challengers to absolute no-hopers in his last two and a half league
campaigns
under wenger we have been no hopers in all but of the last seasons and the reason why we blew that chance is cos of wenger and his blinkered bull***t vision and judgement. In GG's last full seasons we won a cup double (the st team in english football to ever do so) and we won the uefa cup winners cup so a huge step up on where we now are under wenger.
8. his style of football changed from attractive to boring everyone to death inc his own fans-1-0 to the arsenal is not a song of triumph its a witty self -mocking parody acknowledging just how boring we had become.
the style of play under wenger in recent seasons has become so predictable and slow that stevie
wonder can see what is happening. He changed us from a fast break at pace type of team into a slow paced one
dimensional outfit that run out of any ideas very quickly and havent got the guts and passion to grind out results
when that happens unlike GG's teams.

9. wenger for all his faults has never to the best of my knowledge acted corruptly and wilfully to the detriment of the club and that he is well rewarded compared to graham is no excuse for graham who by comparison with your average gooner did quite nicely without bungs.
what type of crap is that ?

10. chapman made arsenal world famous; wenger has made arsenal famous and fantastically popular due to success and brand of football; both have left long-lasting and enduring legacies; 1994 copenhagen was wonderful for all gooners but the rest of the world would have looked on in horror as graham`s anti- football won the day; if graham was a manager today, he`d be managing stoke and loving it.

Chapman was before my time and that of everybody else on here but I, like most long standing genuine Gooners, do not and did not give a flying f**k how we were perceived by the rest of the footballing world when we were winning trophies under GG. Yes it would have been nice to play total football at all times but you dont get trophies for that and the fact that others hated the way we played made it all the sweeter

Without doubt you post some real crap on here and most of the time I treat your musings with the respect they deserve (ie f**k all) but I could not ignore the tripe above. Maybe it is time you went back to posting on your conspiracy sites and maybe one day you can tell us who really shot jfk and whether aliens did land in usa

[rolypoly]

i assume the new rules about no personal abuse do not apply to the intellectually limited like augie or is it because he is part of the clique that dominates this forum

lydersen played 16 times in three years inc sub appearances . of course graham rated him cos that works out at about £25000 per game to graham

no fighting spirit in our team? augie has seen something in last few games everyone else has missed but i respect his views and i am sure he is a fine human being a credit to mankind

[storrmin571]

I'd go for a mix, Chapmans legacy, Wengers innovation when he first came and the invincibles, add in GGs teams with grit. Perfect storm.

[richpye]

It does end up being between Wenger and Chapman for me, two of the greatest innovators of the game having both managed at Arsenal is fantastic.
Graham was certainly a great but for me is in a league slightly below Wenger and Chapman.

Weirdly enough it was the story of Tom Whitaker that got me supporting Arsenal. From what I remember the man was on death's door but still managed to give his team talk - some commitment to the cause that

[augie]

Great news.....we have shown some fighting spirit in our last games so we are now saved - ignore the last few seasons gutless performances but instead focus on 4 bloody games

Have you ever seen a manager buy a player that turns out to be a dud ? Ever hear of the name Amaury Bischoff ? How about alberto mendez ? Or maybe you heard of ju young park who cant even get a game in a team berift of strikers Lyderson couldnt game a game in a defence that had TA6, Bouldie, Dixon and Nutty so being behind them in the pecking order is no embarassment. Am also quite sure that the stigma of the bung thing hung over him and wouldnt have helped his situation so maybe you should consider those factors as well.

Lastly I aint no member of a clique and never have been. I aint a mod and have never been asked to be so where you are getting this crap about me being in an inner sanctum around here is beyond me although maybe it is just another one of your b******t conspiracy theories I would like to think I dont abuse people around here but if you reckon my post is abusive then maybe you should look at your own cos twice in the last 2 days you have insulted my intelligence....people in glass houses shouldnt throw stones

[flash gunner]

Going back to the GG bung thing he did take a bung and i believe it was from the purchase of Johnny Jensen.... We played Bronby in the cup winners cup the directors from both clubs discussed the purchase and it came out that Arsenal paid £2.5million but Brondby only received £2.3 so £200,000 went missing which i beleived was pocketed by the agent and GG....... Now correct me if im wrong but that is bordering on, if not fully, thieving and this is why GG was sacked.

Now the time while GG was at Arsenal was what i consider my time i went virtually all home games and half the aways each season every season and a few after too. I loved the players back then and felt us fans we appreciated by them, GG and the club - unlike today..... but GG stained his record big time over the whole 'bung/thieving' scandal and therefore can not be Arsenals greatest ever manager

[rolypoly]

augie

is it not time you got yourself a proper job a wife some kids some anger management help - you take yourself too seriously and you spend too much time on this forum . learn to play golf -thats good therapy -fresh air -away from the madding crowds and computers.

flash has destroyed your support of graham beautifully-graham was sacked for being a thief and never will a thief be regarded as our greatest manager and if you are being honest in one sense his being sacked saved his reputation because beyond doubt his time was running out - he had lost the plot , stagnated etc the very same arguments that now are applied to wenger only wenger has lasted longer cos he aint a thief unlike graham who in any other walk of life would have done a two year stretch.

anyway take up golf - you will probably find you are better at that than debating.

[flash gunner]

Roly stick to the arguments rather than trying to put other people down, all that get out more, too much time on forums blah blah blah crap . I dont disagree with your arguements on this subject but the put downs can be done without mate

[goonersid]

Roly stick to the arguments rather than trying to put other people down, all that get out more, too much time on forums blah blah blah crap . I dont disagree with your arguements on this subject but the put downs can be done without mate

Shut up Flash you spoon

[flash gunner]

Sticking up for my fellow clique member

[augie]

Roly let me explain to you the difference between thieving money and taking a kickback - a kickback is when you receive money or a gift of some sort from a seller as a "reward" for doing business with them where as thieving is putting your hand in somebody else's pocket or bank account and taking money without their consent. From the info that was made public, Rune Hauge gave GG a cask kickback out of his commision received from brondby for selling lynderson which GG then "trousered" but lets imagine a scenario which seen GG refuse to accept it....would it have gone back into AFC's coffers ? Would it f**k and we all know that. Fact is that GG took the money from hauge not AFC (and I agree that he should not have done so) but this is a practice which goes on in every walk of life and not just football - I know of builders suppliers in the uk who routinely give perks to customers who purchase from them and granted those perks are not in the form of cash but is there any difference ?

[SWLGooner]

Great to see rolypoly back

Got to be Chapman for me. More of an innovator than Wenger, better as a manager than GG, never had these 7 year spells of crapness.

[augie]

I am gonna spend the rest of the day kicking myself for getting into a debate with the guy - normally I ignore the fool but am in foul humour today and allowed myself to get drawn in